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Atlas,

I'm going to disagree with you. You don't deserve the Darwin award. The situation has changed. Your wife is the one indicating that she wants a relationship with you. The affair's breakup is too new to be trusted. She does need to prove that she can start developing your trust. So she took the phone into the bathroom? How do you know she didn't delete the texts that she didn't want you to see and kept a few of her earlier ones before she changed her mind? You don't have to trust her and in fact you shouldn't. It's something she needs to earn. That doesn't mean you shouldn't be apologetic for snooping, but I think that you should tell her that if she wants you to trust her again she needs to be an open book. Next time, out of the blue say that you'd like to look through her messages and such. That part of your process of trusting is to have the opportunity to check her occasionally. It'll get better with time.

As for letting the divorce proceed. That sounds wise to me. Remarriage is always a possibility a year or two down the line.

Atlas, here's my question for you: what would you have done if you saw that she had written back and said, "love you too"? If it were me, I would again distance myself from her, possibly figure it's over, since she couldn't be trusted. What would you do?

Anyway, at this point you no longer have to walk on eggshells with her. She is still driving this R. Why is that? She has indicated a desire to try again. Are you worried that she'll dash for the hills if you establish some boundaries or indicate some conditions for reconciliation? What have you lost if she does? What does that say about her level of commitment to this course if she runs as soon as you establish some conditions?

Good it helps to hear different views.

Thanks, I felt I deserved it for falling back to an old habit so easily. The situation has changed and at this point there is just indication, no real decision or actions upon those indications, she is just taking temp, so I’m not holding my breath.

Couldn’t agree more.

Just, I have no clue what she did in there, changed, etc. I’ve gotten really good though at not leading my thoughts to the extreme, in this instance she dumped messages, but rather to the thought, I don’t know what she did in there. I find it senseless for me to think a thought, react to that thought without proper evidence. However, I do see what your saying, I’m not giving of myself to her, and I’m certainly not emotionally checking in with her. It is way to risky right now.
Agreed
Agreed
I will if we get there, but honestly I don’t think we are that far along for me to have that right. There isn’t a full commitment from either party to commit to reconciliation. I almost feel likes it’s a mid-east peace talk, a lot is being said, but nothing will get done.

I agree, I can’t give up financially what I have arranged. I haven’t talked to a person yet that doesn’t think that is the way to go.

I would have left then. See this is a weird one as well, because I’ve emotionally gotten over the fact that she was having an A. Not to say there are no problems. But about a month after she left, I snooped her phone and to see the things that these two said to each other killed. Then she accidentally left her email up on my browser and to see that killed me. It was a horrible time. So at this point the shock value has really left the building, and I view her in such a state as "it doesn’t surprise me." Until she earns my trust, that’s how I play, with all the pads on. But to answer, I would have left and yes distanced myself from the situation.
YIPEE! Actually I think is helping the DB’ing efforts. I don’t take her crap, and when I do something for her, I think she realizes it is called being nice. For instance the other night I could tell she was upset because I wouldn’t take S out to dinner so she could get some work done. It was her night, I had prior plans and left. When I left, I’d do this at any friends house, she had her garbage ready to go out and so I took it and tossed it. Nothing really, but it must have been for her. She brought it up and thanked me all about it.

I think I’m a door mat when it comes to her, always have been. I know I’m also being as nice as possible until that pen signs that agreement. Not sure what else to say here. Could use some extra 2x4’s, questions, to help me figure this one out?

Indications, which is all they are, are temperature takers. I have already laid out the conditions. MC and Retourvaille. Open Access on phone, email etc.

However, I know the books and everyone says you have to have this open access. I don’t know how comfortable I am with that, and I don’t know why. Sure my W shouldn’t have done what she did, but I wouldn’t consider her moving back in until I could feel I trusted her, so probably like two weeks. Just kidding, I have no idea how long that would take.

We all sit here and talk about how our trust accounts with our spouses are empty or closed and how can we ever have them full again. Well, isn’t it there job to deposit? On the opposite side of that, what are we doing to deposit in our account with them? Wouldn’t that be a positive feedback loop, or something like that. But it takes 2, I know and so does everyone else you can’t trust blindly.

Just_me, thank you for the very thought provoking response. Those really help.

Atlas,

I thought you were farther along than that. If you are just at temperature taking, then she still needs the space to work through her stuff and you can't get ahead of yourself. I think you really need to just stay still if you don't think she's completely serious about trying again. Give it some more time. Don't be sucked back in, but don't be too aloof.


Anyway, this is a scary time for you I suspect....do I really get my hopes up? Is this really what I want? Am I just asking for more hurt? Sounds like you'll navigate it. Good luck to you Atlas.

Me

Thanks Just,

We aren't farther along then what I think you thought. She is scared, in the last month or so, she has broke it off with OM. Ya we will see. Her whole family is infighting over this. So I think 2 things are happening. 1. She is scared and sick of it all, and I'm a safe place, because I can't fight anymore, I don't argue. I just go along with things. 2. I do think she is trying to see if she can rediscover those feelings.

Who knows, what the he!! she is thinking. I have no clue. But if she wants to be around, I'm fine with that. But I'm not going to let myself get sucked back in. That's not fun.

Having watched your very un-fun roller coaster ride over the summer, please don't.

On a totally flippant note, maybe her family will decide to go somewhere in a single vehicle and get wiped out at once I don't really mean that, but, damn, they seem to hold a lot of power over your W. Wasn't the sister pushing her to D you over the summer as well?

Glad your W is showing enough evidence of want to to merit you being back here though.

BD

Tonight was a little interesting. I really expected to be ditched, and I had the chance at NBA tickets, which is my favorite. Well outside of college ball. So I thought I would give W the out and make it easy. Childish I know. So I sent a text and said are you coming tonight, because if not I’m going to the game. She immediately called and said “I thought we were going to hang out, well no, you should go to the game if you want.” I replied that I would rather hang with her, but if she wasn’t coming then I was going to the game.” I mean she already knows I stand for this M, so I figured what does it hurt? Plus since I seem to be more sensitive and expressing my feelings, I think this is my 180. She responds pretty positively to it.

So I said alright lets hang. So I left a little early and she calls stating they (S and W) are on there way. Well she is 5 minutes away put I’m 20. So I say I just left and we meet at the house. Very pleasant, no pushing nothing. We talk about the settlement and how we will go about it. I had offered dinner so we went out as a family. Lots of talk at dinner about impending D and what will happen after.

She brings up OM, wants to explain how and why. She makes some jokes about him and says he won’t leave her alone, but he she thinks he could be violent and wants to stay away from him, but then retracts and says she doesn’t need any help. No idea if anything is true, but I’m willing to accept whatever until I see differently. Apparently he was engaged, she broke it off and W says it was an A of convenience and she said it was unhealthy for both parties and he can’t see it. Which since she is a therapist for her to say that it is a big deal, it appears she has made a decision. But I know it is an addiction, so we will see.

We eat and laugh have a good time. Then she wants to hit Barnes and Noble to buy “Eat, Love, Live” or something like that. Apparently it is recommended by Ohpera (Sp?). Apparently it is about a women having an A and then finding what women want in life. Better read it I guess. Then W says she broke a promise to me, she was going to read Ch. 13 and 14 of His Needs, Her needs the other day. She says she couldn’t because she couldn’t do more then a few pages without breaking down. Says her A hurts her so much that she can’t read about them yet. But says she will read the book.

Later we discuss the D and then working on us. She says she wants to and thinks it is a good idea, but she isn’t ready yet. She thinks she has done too much wrong and I don’t deserve her, but someone that is a good person. Her self-esteem is shot to crap. I state that we will get the D and then it is up to her, and she thinks she wants to try.

I ask her what changed. Our state, when there are kids, you have to go to these parenting classes prior to divorce. She said she went and what was said just killed her. She realized what she was doing to our S and felt horrible. Then she said that there were couples there that seemed like friends even though they were D’ing. She said she made a choice then to be my friend. Then she said now that she is my friend, had the A, and dated other guys, she says the grass isn’t greener, and she thinks she messed it up so bad. But she is thinking of trying. But she can’t see how I can take her back after what I did. Says she never could.

Then she says once the D is final she thinks I should date, so that I know for sure she is the one or not. Not sure what that is about. Said I already know what I want. That ended that.

My family is Mormon, which is rather religious, but I’m not. She brought my suggestion of D’ing and then trying to live together after some courtship and see what happens. She says she can’t because my family would judge her so harshly. Well she was blown away by the fact that this idea was actually my fathers who is a very religious man and would see this as sin. I actually, on my own curiosity, challenged him on this, and he stated that if it is meant to be, he wont’ think God would mind. Which for a Mormon, that is pretty huge to say. When I told her this, she was totally floored, started crying and said she was so happy that my family wouldn’t judge her.

Ended the night with a good embrace, had a great time throughout. She isn’t feeling so pressured as the other nights.

On a side note the other day S and I fell down the stairs, I ended up on my back, and then when I saw that I had thrown him, I leaped forward and caught him but crashed into the wall. So my shoulder is messed and my back and one leg pretty bad. She asked if I was taking care of myself and asked if I needed a back rub, not thinking, I was like Oh I’m fine I have advil. Haha idiot!

Thanks.

Oh, I forgot to add. W and I discussed X-mas. Her family and mine both have our big parties on X-mas eve. She asked what to do, she brought it up. So I proposed that she take S to her party X-mas eve, I'll go to mine, then that night we meet at the house and I'll sleep on the couch. We have X-mas as a family and I'll make breakfast. Then I get S the rest of the day with my family. She agreed this was good and we are going to do it.

Wow, she had plans with you and followed through! That's pretty new.

You should've taken that back rub offer

BD

Weird day for sure. So we have 10 days to get our temporary order in after the judge ruled. Part of that order, which I stipulated to, is a child custody evaluation. So W states she fired her lawyer Monday after the hearing. Well I have to have the order in by Friday. She wants to sign a settlement, however, if her attorney doesn’t withdrawal we can’t go that route, and oh guess what, he hasn’t withdrawn. So my lawyer sent a letter stating we chose X for the child custody evaluation, I’m not having my lawyer right up a settlement until her lawyer withdrawals from the case.

So today my attorney, in the same building, and he knows I want to DB, shows up in my office with an apology and says her ya go. Well it is her attorney responding to our choice of a child custody evaluator. So someone is BS’ing me, either her attorney or her. Well I have been lied to by one particular party so I go with it. I text her and say do you know that X still thinks he is your lawyer, what is going on. I’m not letting down my guard, until I have a full commitment and that will be post D.

No answer all day. So I start to think it figures passed on past actions, luckily I wasn’t sucked in. So W calls when she got home from work. Didn’t go to OM’s, YAAA! I can hear her dryer through the phone, very distinctive sound. He could be there, but I doubt it. So she is offensive and asks what is going on.

I ask her what she means, she reads me a letter from her lawyer. “Apparently Mr. Atlas is hedging his bets, he has chosen a child custody evaluator, so your statement that mediation is occurring is false.” Basically he says I’m taking her for a ride and she better lawyer up. Well I explain to her that I have 10 days to comply with the judge our I’m in contempt of court. Then she reads me another letter where he calls her a bad mother for not trying harder. What a piece of work. She gets the picture and says she will call him tomorrow and without a doubt say he is fired.

After that we have a pretty good convo for about 20 minutes. Went very well, so both parties are suspicious and untrust’ED, little reference. Haha. I’m feeling really good about things, and she offered to dismiss tonight and says she never wanted it, but I held my ground and said I think it is better to leave behind the prior M, get the D, and then try and rebuild since the ruble will be out of the way. She agrees. We will see.

Excellent choice IMHO, Atlas. I truly believe this is this wisest, most sensible, and healthiest thing you can do, both for you and for your R/M.

Bravo, lad!

GD