http://www.themarriagebed.com/boards/ is a Christian site with a number of marriage-related forums. The owners of this site also make available daily e-mails with marriage-related tips, under their links "The Generous Wife" and "The Generous Husband."
This week's e-mails to "The Generous Husband," to which I have been subscribing for some time, have all involved tips for husbands who want/need more sex. I've put them all together below.
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This idea speaks to sexuality.
I get a lot of e-mail that says, in one way or another, "how can I get more sex". If I had a sure fire answer for that (or even a works half the time answer), I'd be a rich and famous man. But I can give y'all some information and ideas that will help most of you some, and a few of you a lot. So, if you can't handle any more sex, tune out for a few days. Otherwise, read and PRAY!
Q. How often should a normal woman want sex?
A. First we have to define normal woman, want, and sex.
Sex: Is it only sex if one or both of you climax? Women can see something as sex, and enjoy it, without anyone climaxing. Is it only sex if there is intercourse? While I am increasingly convinced that intercourse is created by God to be better and better for us than any other form of love making, I do not limit "sex" to intercourse.
Want: Men usually want sex because they feel pressure that they want released. Physical pleasure, emotional pleasure, and closeness also rank high for guys. For women it can be very different - it is not unusual for a woman to feel a want for sex when she has no physical urge she needs to deal with, and no desire for the pleasure we call orgasm. A woman can want and need sex for reasons limited to relationship or comfort. When we try to make their "want" be like ours, we do them a disservice, and interfere with them following their desires.
Normal Woman: Let me change that to "healthy woman". Physically healthy yes, but even more emotionally healthy. Sex is very, very emotional and mental for a women, and any emotional, relational or mental difficulties will mess with her desire for and enjoyment of sex. Beyond this, there is the issue of any sexual harassment or abuse she has suffered over the years since her birth. As I look at our world, I would say any woman who comes of age in modern America has been sexually harassed or abused by society, and the same is true to a greater or lesser degree in many other countries. If a woman has not dealt with that, it's going to haunt her sex life. The other issue on "normal woman" is that for women age and phase of life had a substantial impact on sexuality. Young women are more likely to be ambivalent about orgasm than older ones, and far less likely to have multiple orgasms. Young women may also, paradoxically, be more open to or aggressive about sex and sexual variety. Middle age women may have a sharp rise in sex drive. Mothers of young children are often too tired for much sex, or want it simple and straightforward. Menopause offers other ups and downs.
As you can see, the question really does not have an answer. The closest I can come to an answer is to say I am convinced God intends us to be willing and able to have enough sex to fully satisfy ourself and our spouse.
Does she know how much she wants/needs?
That seems like an odd question to most men. Beginning at puberty, our penis makes us very aware of what arouses us, and of when we are aroused enough to want to seek some release. This God created bio-feedback system also helps us to learn to feel and well understand our sexual condition - how aroused we are, and how much we do or do not "need it".
Women, however, don't have anything as drastic or noticeable as an erection to help them learn to read their bodies. A woman's bodily arousal changes are both slower and subtler than ours, and they are fairly easily missed or ignored. Some women have no idea if they are aroused or not unless they are well into sex and close to climax. At this extreme it's usually because some negative teaching about sex has left her unwilling to be aware of her body, but it can also be a result of continually choosing to ignore her arousal because it's inconvenient, inappropriate, or has no outlet acceptable to her. Choose to ignore it long enough, and you can lose the ability to choose to feel it.
There is also the issue of it being wrong for a woman to want sex, or to initiate it, or to have it more than some low level that is acceptable. All of these are of course unbiblical, but the ideas still exist. Similarly, some woman put so much energy into not being sexual prior to marriage that they don't know how to turn around and want and enjoy sex after marriage.
Porn and some "adult fiction" has promoted the idea that you help a woman realise she wants more by pushing her to have more. In reality this almost always ends badly. Even when it seems to work, in that she has and enjoys sex, it usually results in negative feelings on her part, and a worsening of the original problem.
All The Usual Answers
There are a host of common "answers" given when a fellow says he wants his wife to have a bit more sex. The reason these answers are so commonly given is that they are all valid and for many women the list hits one or more problems they have. So don't dismiss what is below just because you think something else is going on - even if something else is going on, one or more of the following can be adding to the problem.
Tired: Because of our stronger physical drive, men have to be far more tired than women to be too tired for sex. If she is tired, she won't be feeling a desire to have sex, and will find it difficult or impossible to fully enter into and enjoy sex. Anything you can do to help her be less tired will help if this is an issue.
Too busy: Busyness can leave us mentally and emotionally drained even if we are not left tired. Because sex is far more mental and emotional for women than for men, things that drain a woman in these areas take a heavy toll on her sexuality. You might be able to help by taking some of her tasks on, but for many couples the total that needs to be done is beyond what is compatible with an intimate and sexual relationship. What are you willing to give up for a deeper relationship?
Stressed: As with tiredness, it takes less stress to turn a woman off than it does a man. Are there things that can change to decrease her stress level? Can you do things that will help her to un-stress - a massage, an evening walk, or giving her time for a long kid free hot bath?
She needs transition time: You can probably go from just about anything to sex in a couple of seconds - but most women can't do that. She needs transition time from being a mother to being a wife, and from being a worker to a lover. Adding to this issue is the fact that women are often "on duty" till just before they go to bed, leaving her needing an hour after she gets to bed to be able to be sexual.
She feels unappreciated: Notice I said feels - this is not about what you do or don't do, but about how she feels about it. You may appreciate her, but fail to show and communicate that. Or maybe she can't receive what you are saying. Regardless of why she feels it, a woman does not desire to be sexual with a man she feels does not appreciate her.
She feels taken for granted: As above. This is where "he never helps with the kids" or "he never helps around the house" comes in - it's not just the work load, it's the feeling of being left to do it all.
Hormones: Her monthly cycle gives her times of higher and lower desire - or desire and no desire. More on that here . Pregnancy, birth, and nursing also cause hormonal changes that can interfere with her desire, her speed of arousal, and her ability or speed of orgasm. Menopause, and the years leading up to it bring about further hormonal difficulties. Good communication, honest, and all the love and caring you can muster will help with these. Be prepared to do things differently, and for sex to be different.
Sex is not enjoyable for her: If she does not enjoy it, why would she want to do it? This does not just mean be sure she has an orgasm - a woman can have an orgasm every time and still not enjoy sex. Orgasm is a physical reaction to sustained stimulation, and it does not mean that there is mental and emotional pleasure occurring. Some women say that orgasm is less important than the mental and emotional - to the point that they may find some no orgasm sex as good as or better than some that had orgasm. Also be aware that what a woman wants and enjoys sexually changes with time of the month, stage of life, how she is feeling about your marriage, how tired she is, and on and on. What was good a few years ago may be nothing now. What was "ho hum" last week might be "oh yeah" today. Don't look for the magic move that will always make it good for her - rather learn to hear her and read her so you can give her what she most needs every time.
I've mentioned this recently, but based on what Lori and I hear from women, it's something that needs to be said repeatedly. It seems a lot of husbands put a qualification on sex that often leaves the wife feeling she must say no.
I'm not talking about requesting something weird - I'm talking about expecting/requiring her to climax every time you have sex. I'm not saying she should not climax every time, if she wants to do so, but it should be about what she wants. If she wants to have sex with you and not climax, or wants to have sex when she is not sure if she will want to climax, you really ought to let her do that, don't you think? If you expect her to climax when she does not want to do so (or knows she won't be able to do so easily) then you have set her up for a bad choice - say yes and have to force it, fake it, or disappoint you, or say no.
Of course the whole things is odd to men, since we generally orgasm very easily. Women don't orgasm as easily as we do, varying from not quite as easily to needing a lot of mental and physical effort. Some women find orgasm easy most or all of the time - but this is the exception. Some find it takes real effort every time, some only at certain times (related to her cycle, how tired she it, what's on her mind and so on). All women have a range of how easily and quickly they can climax, and aside from times when it's just not going to happen, there are other times when it's just not worth the effort.
All that said, God did something interesting when He designed the woman's sexual function - He created women so that they can easily become aroused enough to comfortably have intercourse, even when they don't "feel horny" and don't want, or can't have, a climax. That means she can provide you with sex when she's not feeling the need or desire for an orgasm.
I said "the need or desire for an orgasm" because a woman can desire sex without desiring orgasm. Again, that is odd to men, but it's not uncommon for women. A woman can want and enjoy sex for reasons of intimacy, closeness, and emotional pleasure. In addition to the fact she might want and enjoy it, intercourse is physically, emotionally, and relationally beneficial for a women even without orgasm.
The real issue then, if your wife is willing to sometimes have intercourse without orgasm, is this: can you get your head around it? Does your pride require her to climax every time? Is the need for her to always climax so great you will cheat both of you out of "good" when "better" is not available?
About that “mental and emotional stuff”
In response to the Monday tip, a wife wrote to me and said: ... explain in more detail the "mental and emotional" part that we as women need and experience to have true love making ... my husband just doesn't get it. It his mind, sex is sex. I suspect this woman is like a lot of wives - she wants to have and enjoy sex, but her husband's failure to understand what that means for her prevents that. She may say yes and just endure it, or she may often say no because she does not want sex to be something to endure - but either way she and her husband are both being cheated out of what God intended sex to be.
It's like a man's sexuality is hard wired to his penis, and most guys can have sex on auto-pilot, needing little or no involvement of their minds or emotions. Woman are not this way - their minds sit between their sexuality and their genitals, and if the mind is not having its needs met, then sex is empty and without pleasure, even if the physical stimulation causes a climax. Men too often make the the mistake that a woman's orgasm is proof she wanted and enjoyed the sex - in reality climax can and does occur when a woman neither wanted nor enjoyed the sex.
So what makes sex good for a woman? When sex is part of a loving and caring relationship, and the sexual part of the relationship is full of love and caring, then sex is good for a woman. When she feels desired (not just lusted) and wanted (for more than the orgasm she can give) and cherished - then sex is good. When there is emotional intimacy before, during, and after sex, sex is good for a woman. When meeting her emotional and mental needs is at least as important as making her body climax, then she enjoys sex. When her orgasm is seen as a result of a loving act, rather than a proof of his manhood, it's an orgasm worth having.
For the women reading along: A comment on "in his mind sex is just sex". While this is certainly the case for some men, I think it's mostly a result of a man not having the amount of sex his body wants/needs. For men sexual release is a strong body desire, and when that release is not frequent enough, there is an intensifying of his desire for release. When sex occurs for a man like this, his body is pushing him to climax as fast as possible - something incompatible with the kind of love making a woman wants and needs. His body ignores his mind and emotions, and sex becomes nothing but a physical act designed to achieve needed release. However, when a man is having sufficient release to keep his body from feeling deprived, something interesting happens. Suddenly he is not driven to get to climax as fast as possible, and his mind and emotions are allowed to enter into the sexual act. He starts to feel with something more than his penis, and he finds that sex has deeply enjoyable and gratifying mental, emotional, and relational facets. What's more, once he experiences these, he wants them, and will work to keep them a part of sex. I suspect many men never get to this point, but those who do learn to enjoy sex more than most men, and learn how to give their wife a sexual experience that touches far more than her body.
Working out marital issues usually requires some communication - and sexual issues are no different. The difficulty is so many of us feel uncomfortable discussing sex - even with our spouse (and women tend to be this way more than men). If you want a better sex life - or more of a sex life - finding a way to talk about sex with your bride is vital. In fact, the lack of clear communication about sex may not just an obstacle to change, perhaps it's part of the problem to start with.
One problem point for many women in discussing sex is the choice of words. Use whatever she is most comfortable with (or least uncomfortable with). If slang is what she knows, then use that. If slang offends her, use other words. Try to avoid authoritative and judgmental statements, and as much as possible talk about emotional feelings rather than physical feelings. For most women before, during and after sex are poor times to discuss sex (though for some women it will be best) - try to find a safe time, and don't do it when she might feel trapped (like while driving in the car together). Focus on one or two clearly defined issues - don't drag in so many issues that you get lost. Make sure she has heard what you mean, and that you have heard what she means.
As to what you want - be honest. If you want sex five times a week, don't tell her you want it three times a week thinking you can ask for more when you get to three times a week. At the same time, be realistic about the distance between what you want and the current situation - don't expect some miraculous overnight change. Once you have let her know what you would like, ask her what it will take to get from here to there - and be prepared to hear some things that have nothing to do with sex (non-sexual things can make or break her sexuality). Beyond that, ask her what she wants in general, what you can do or change to bless her. It's not payment, but it is appropriate to show a desire to do for her when you are asking her to do for you.
A note on being refused sex - if you didn't ask, you could not have been refused. This is more than just semantics, really. If you are sure she will say no, and thus do not ask, who has prevented sex? No mater how well you think you know her, you might be wrong. What's more, if you don't ask when you want to, you are really lying to her about your desires. Aside from the dishonest of that, it means she does not have a real picture of what you want and need. If you only ask when you think she will say yes, then from her perspective she says yes most or all of the time.
Follow up: A couple of you protested that wanting her to enjoy sex (by always climaxing) was loving, not selfish. My point is that she should have something to say about what makes sex enjoyable for her, and having to enjoy it your way or suffer the consequences is not loving.
If all of the above has failed –
If the last week of tips have failed to give you any direction or ideas for talking to your wife about your sexual frustration, you will probably have to take more drastic action.
If your wife is well aware that you are unhappy with the situation, and she is not making an effort to change, what does that mean? It could mean she is just selfish. It could mean she has bought into the lie that men who want sex are being selfish. She may have non-sexual problems in your marriage that you either don't see or refuse to deal with. She may have past sexual issues such as abuse, rape, or guilt over past sexual activities. Maybe she believes that sex is nasty, bad, unholy, or for some other reason not to be enjoyed. Maybe she has sexual problems like pain, difficulty in getting aroused, or inability to climax. How you go approach the situation will depend to some degree on why she won't deal with it. If you have tried to work on it and she won't, then you will need to involve a third party such as a pastor or counselor - find someone who has experience with the issue you need to deal with!
If your bride has resisted your efforts to deal with this in the past, she is not going to easily change. Your only chance of getting her to deal with it is to make it clear that you intend to push the issue. She needs to know it's not something you just think would be nice - she needs to know it's very important to you. She needs to know the current situation is not just displeasing to you, but is a real problem. Ultimately it's going to be about how important it is to you, and thus how much you are willing to push the issue. For most men, this also means being sure that what we want is reasonable, acceptable, and right with God. If you have any doubt about these things, it's going to be used against you. The other side of this, is that what you are asking for must be reasonable and acceptable in your current life circumstances, and right with God.
Am I encouraging you to pressure your wife for sex? Not exactly - I am actually encouraging you to be completely honest about your sexual needs. It's not the same thing, even if it seems like the same thing to her. Most men get deeper and deeper into this problem by not being honest - by not letting her know how it hurts them, by hoping that they can wait it out. If a lack of honesty got you into the problem, it is doubtful that an ongoing lack of honesty is going to bring about an improvement.
If you continue to have problems getting your wife to take this seriously, I strongly recommend the book " Loving Solutions" by Gary Chapman
Follow up: Since I promised to end this with this tip, I'm going to do a fast Q&A to address some of the more common comments and questions I have received the last couple of days. Some of these questions are not exact quotes from any of you, but rather a composite of various e-mails:
Q. It hurts to be refused over and over. I have a hard time with the rejection. I can't take no any more. At least cut a brother a break by acknowledging that the road you're advising us to take might hurt very badly.
A. Yes, it hurts - I know from experience that it hurts. I also know that you can't expect her to see it as a real issue if you don't ask. I don't know a way to keep it from hurting, I wish I did. One thing you can do is let her know what you need. Make it very clear to her that it's a problem for you to go more than "x amount of time" without sex. Tell her you may not ask all the time, because of how much rejection hurts - but that does not mean you don't want sex, and it does not mean you are not hurting because she is not taking your needs seriously.
Q. When I ask for sex a lot, she get's angry/upset, or she sulks, or she says no because "I ask too often".
A. I would say this is manipulation on her part. She is reacting in a way designed to keep you from asking her next time. It may not be calculated as much as a learned response, but that is the bottom line. The only other explanation is that she has bought into lies about men and sex, and is angry at you because based on her reality, you are being selfish and demanding.
Q. When I wait for her we have very little sex, and I feel like she is controlling me.
A. Some guys find they have more sex if they don't ask, but wait for her - however most find this results in even less sex than asking. Still, the lack of open hostility that not asking brings is tempting.
Q. How does a generous husband let his wife know that he really would like sex without it seeming to be putting undue emphasis on it? I had thought not asking was being a “gentleman”.
A. Again I see it about honesty. Because I love my wife, I want to know what she wants, needs, and desires. I want to know those things so I can give them to her to the best of my ability. I assume that my wife loves me in the same way, and thus wants to know what I want, need and desire. If she does not want to know these things, than there is a problem in our marriage that has nothing to do with sex. The thing that can make sex different than any other aspect of marriage is a cultural lie that says sex is not as big a deal as men say, they don't really need it, they are selfish, it's really an attempt to control or manipulate their wife, and so on. If a woman buys into this lie, she can set sex outside of her normal self, treat it differently, and feel perfectly justified in rejecting her husband in a way she would never do over any other issue. We also have to overcome the "gender neutral" issue that our society has been living for many years now. The truth is that men and woman are fundamentally different, and sexual differences are far greater than most of us (including most men) are willing or able to admit. If you buy into the idea that men and women are basically the same, then men's sexual requests are seen as selfish by any women who does not feel the same thing herself. The reality is that God created men with a strong sex drive, and tied a good deal of our self image to our sexuality. Society has no doubt corrupted this, but the fact remains that a man who is being refused sex by his wife is deeply hurt by her choice. If a woman comes to understand what her failure to meet her husband's sexual needs really does to him, she has a difficult choice to make - she either does what it takes to do what is right, or she hardens her heart and continues to abuse him. Perhaps this hard choice is why many women work hard to not know what she is doing to her husband - ignorance is bliss.
Be blessed, be generous, and women first! <>< Paul
That part about honesty was so on the mark. Especially about the part of women buying into the stuff about genders being the same. This allows the women to DISMISS sex, to treat sex as SHE would treat it. This allows the women to IGNORE what men are really about.
Unfortunately, there is very little advice in their that is beneficial. Look at that liast paragraph, the LD women has two choices, and both of them are going to be bad. She will have to either completely change herself to become FAR more sexual, and that is going to be REALLY hard, or she is going to harden her heart, which means destroying everything about her marriage, which means FAILING at her marriage vows. In effect being LD in marriage means failure of the marriage.
I find it Ironic that men really experience the TRUE purpose of sex, which is the closeness, the initmacy, the oneness, only AFTER they have satisfied the physical needs of sex. This is what is going to FRUSTRATE the man so much, since the true pupose of sex can only be had by couples that have a high freqency of sex. In other words, sex is going to fill a lot of needs in marrriage ONLY when the couple has LOTS of sex, which of course does NOT happen when you are married to a LD woman. Think about that one, the man can not achieve what he really wants from sex until the couple is having sex at a frequnecy that is FAR beyond what the woman can achieve.
Not sure what you mean. The article was saying that men treat sex as sex until the frequency gets high enough that it is no longer about a physical urge, but is now moving into the emotional needs, which is the point where sex becomes Making Love. But this frequency of having sex is WAY beyond what a LD spouse would even contemplate. So how could a LD spouse achieve this?
I mean, the way you stated it, made it sound like the HD spouse was asking for the impossible. As if the LD spouse is "incapable" of meeting the HD spouse's needs.
"not wanting to", "not being in the mood", and "being incapable of", are all separate things, wouldnt you say?
My current status: june 2006. Wife ran out and filed D. Finalized Jan 11, 2010, after 12.5 years M. 3 wonderful sons caught in the middle
not wanting to", "not being in the mood", and "being incapable of", are all separate things, wouldnt you say? It is my opinion that for LD people "not being in the mood", not wanting to", equals the LD person feeling incapable of enjoying sex.
Yes, they are different things, but tell that to most LD people. I suspect they see it as A+B=C and that is the way it is, so move on and think about something else other than sex.
To many LD folks it is true, that is till someone wants to leave, as in the case of RHW. WTG RHW for the changes.^5
Dom, some people change, some change for a little while, some don't understand things from the HD person's POV.
When my W was being treated for breast cancer I asked her how long she saw her Dr. on each visit. BB said she saw him 2-3 minuets. I asked her why does the Dr. bill her $450.00? (actual treatment bill was separate)
She came back and asked me if I wanted her to stop her treatment sessions. Of course, I said no, I didn't want her to stop her treatments, I was wanting to know what she got for $450.
The treatments were on another bill that added up to $30,000.
Then she said, "what difference does it make what he charges, insurance pays for everything."
All I wanted to know was what services was she receiving for each Dr. charge but to this day BB talks like I wanted her to not have the treatment sessions. Nothing is further from the truth but she thinks what she thinks.
BB worked in the hospital and wouldn't tell patients anything about average costs for those that self-paid, (didn't have insurance) and wouldn't tell the client who to ask, as to what things cost.
In the case of her treatments more than 10 yrs ago, she still tells people I tried to talk her out of some of her treatment options. Not so but it is sort of like a false equation and I don't care to rehash the issue with her. She believes what she believes, sort of A+B=C.
