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Hey Puddle
So "Open" means exactly the way you described the guy...sexy eh? Laying all the cards on the table is generally where I get to pretty quickly with most people. Rare that I hold anything back. I have learned that a good spot is somewhere near where I am sharing TOO much and keeping people guessing a bit.

Its funny, I seem to be unique in the aspect and it really throws people to the point where they think I am trying to "get something" from them so they close down. In biz, this tactic only works when your in charge, the rest of the time, when I was working for others, it backfired a lot and I got slapped down A LOT. So, Too honest is bad, Hiding things is bad, Always saying what is on your mind is BAD BAD BAD, so there is a balance.

I can tell you this though, CLOSED OFF IS JUST AS BAD AS TOO OPEN. e.g. Wife and CVA, respectively.

Hey L2, ST, CVA, and everyone!



Hee hee, thanks for the laugh. I was thinking something along the lines of, "Hey there, I'm looking good, thanks to you, *^$%$^%$, so do you wanna ____ or what?" Not attractive.



Yep, that's me. And it hasn't been working for me either, never has, and I've been working on that one for years. (But much, much more successfully lately.)



I totally agree. For me it has more to do with admitting how I'm feeling---doesn't have to be long-winded.



That's the problem, though---I *don't* want to. I'd freak out if H changed his mind right now, but for me, the trying when I don't want to is the test. He didn't want to so didn't; I have to try anyway, at least for the sake of my kids. I wonder if I'm doomed to fail because I don't want to succeed, but I have to try.

Last night I was going to bed, in a T-shirt, and thought, damn, I have to put on that stupid sexy little outfit. Felt like a chore, but I did it. Same thing this morning: heard H's alarm go off, desperately wanted to sleep in, but dragged my butt out of bed and made coffee.

Hey ST! Thanks for checking in; always happy to hear your thoughts.



I emailed him today and asked whether he'd like to set up a time to talk or wing it, said I thought setting something up was the way to go. He responded with yes, definitely set something up, we're no good at winging it. When I asked how a specific night worked for him, he suggested we give it until 9 ("if we make it that far"), then part ways. Charming.

Hey CVA! Thanks for checking in, my friend. I know you've got tons going on right now. Hope you're doing well.



You have no idea. You know, I had a BF once who wanted to share all his feelings with me re us and his childhood, and it was a complete turn-off. I think that was because I wasn't really into him in the first place, and because he did it so pathetically.

I still believe it's possible, though (see the guy I mentioned earlier), but there seems to have to be some attraction there first, some desire to see the person favorably, that affects my interpretation. And not that pathetic "Please please understand me!" behind it.



Yes, balance is key. Since I fall so far on one end of the spectrum, balance is a new place for me, and fraught with uncertainty.



Yes, I know this from experience as well. Man, CVA, I hope you're doing great. I know things are rough right now.

H and I have had this email exchange going lately, and it's been interesting. He keeps sending me bullet-pointed emails, full of questions and actions we need to take. The other night he asked me (in a bullet point) if I blame him for the D, and I said no. Then he responded with something like thanks for this, though I'm not sure I believe you. Keeps asking me questions, then saying he doesn't quite believe me. That's okay. He will.

Today he sent one that said (forgive the length; too tired to summarize):

"I want to thank you for how you've been handling this situation. I know it hasn't been easy on you, and it's great to see you go out and enjoy yourself, and spending 1:1 time with the kids. You seem to feel good about yourself, and that's awesome.
You've been gracious over the past 3 months, and I appreciate the space you've given me.
Last night, for the first time, I felt a sadness, you know, sadness of something coming to an end. Nothing depressing, but a feeling that was new to me."

I think I know exactly what he means. "Last night" was the night he asked me if I wanted to talk and I said I was tired. I might ought to have gotten up and talked.

In these emails I also told him I didn't feel like there was any need to increase the amount of time he spends at home after he moves out (in response to his proposition that he comes home to see the boys every night). He thought about it and agreed. Truth is, I need some time to reclaim this place as my own, not ours.

He suggested we spend an hour together (all four of us) before one of us takes off for the evening. I said that sounds great occasionally---don't think I want to do every night---and he said he'd let me "drive" that. God I hate that business speak, but okay.

He wants to start interviewing mediators this week, wants to get the money stuff settled so he knows what he has to work with.

On to the other guy. He texted yesterday morning to ask if I'd be up for some frisbee in the afternoon. I had the kids, so said, "Can't do today unless it's frisbee by moonlight." No response. Today it went like this:

me: Are you upfor hanging out tomorrow night or Saturday night [my free time this week]?
him: Are you free at all today? I'm playing hooky.
me: Wish I were---there's no hooky from the kids. Have fun playing.
him: I have work to do, but I would've carved out some fun time for you. Too bad it's inappropriate for the three of us to hang out. Maybe next spring or summer?
me: We'll see how they're doing. I know they'd respond to your childlike side. Let me know when our respective carved-out time aligns.

No response.

Not sure what I think about this, but what I'm doing is scheduling myself to the fullest. Peter Pan can be a bit frustrating for someone who needs to plan ahead, so I'm certainly not holding those few windows open hoping he'll step up. But seriously? A very sexy guy.

H just stopped by unexpectedly to get shoes appropriate for going out to dinner. Ugh, I hate that surprise thing.

Take care, all.

regarding H's sadness. I think that was a good thing. He's probably gonna have more of it. I think it's more of a wakeup call. And don't feel bad not talking then, because you were tired, and you may have reacted less than pleasant, so I think it was fine. The rest of the email sounded really good. And SEE, he still isn't believing the changes, and that's a big part of DBing, it takes our repetitive actions (that become true changes, changes that are for ourselves not for our spouse) that ultimately prove to them we have changed.

hey, and I know your feelings on your H are pretty much non-existant right now, but you know that can change as well. feelings are temporary, love is a choice. and it's definitely possible for you to have feelings for him again, if the chance arises.

I think part of it, is the new guy. It is helping you get over H, IMHO, and I could really see some strong feelings come from you for him. But do remember, those feelings will fade too.

I had heard from my pastor that the statistics for 1st marriages are on average 5 years. It seems obvious that this is the time where the honeymoon has already faded, and the hardwork is put in , or should be put in.

I am really glad and proud of you to continue to work on your M, even though you don't really want to right now, but that is such a blessing to see. Your children are very blessed to have you as their mom.

Hey ST,



I hadn't thought of that. Saw it more as H's inability to believe I'm okay with the sitch, as opposed to I've "changed." You may be right, not sure.



That's what I'm holding onto for now. It's funny, though, I so know what he means about "just not wanting it." Feelings do change, though, and I'm going to choose to do my best by him in the meantime.



Really, where do you see that? I feel like I've pulled way back re him. I'm putting my feelings about him---whatever they are, and I'm honestly not sure yet---on the back burner for now, because it doesn't help any with H. If I'm right about where he is and what kind of guy he is, that'll probably pull him right back into my orbit. That's not why I'm doing it, but it may be a side effect.



Thanks, ST! When I feel like I'd rather just give up and get some rest, I think of them and how much better I think their lives would be if they had a happy, intact family, and that's a pretty darn good motivator.

Heim: locked you up. How you doing? How was the weekend?

Take care.

"Really, where do you see that? I feel like I've pulled way back re him. "

well, it's more of a prediction, based on what I'm seeing right now. there is innocent flirting going on and I totally see myself in your position right now.

I didn't realize you were pulling yourself away from him. I assumed the turndowns for his invites were due to real reasons, being with the kids. Were you using them as an excuse? If so, I'm sorry for the assumption.

I can just really see myself where you are right now. I'm actually a lot better with guys, and have always had more guy friends than girls (except post sitch) and it was just fun, lots of innocent flirting. except when it was a guy I thought was really cute, and he was really filling my needs at the time (because my H was very distant then). It was SO innocent in the beginning, and it turned way bad. I'm still so shocked at what I did. it was totally not me. so that's why I say all these things. If my H and I had never resolved our problem during my A (we weren't M yet, but engaged) than I could definitely have seen myself going with it much longer than it had and it totally could have ruined things for sure. I just don't want you to get in that position. Because I know how good you could feel if you allowed yourself to go further with this guy, only because he's cute and fun to be with, and it's almost like you'd be having an A too and the rush from it and the new feelings you get totally mess with your mind. But I'm really glad you understand how feelings can come and go. I didn't have that frame of mind back then, and I became soooooo uterly confused with my feelings.

does that make more sense?

Hey ST,



I wasn't using the kids as an excuse: I really couldn't hang out. What I mean by pulling back is I'm flirting with him a lot less, and I'm consciously thinking about him as a friend and not a possible romantic interest. There'll be plenty of time for that later, with him or someone else.



Yes, except to me it wouldn't be an A. Still, I'm not clear yet on whether I have a hard and fast timeline in mind: whether I'll wait until H moves out, until a D is final, etc. But right now for me, when I'm having such a hard time finding motivation to keep the focus on H, being involved with someone else is a distraction I can't really afford.



Yes, I think you're saying it's more a general statement about what this kind of R can turn into than an observation about my interactions with this guy. I was just curious as to what kind of vibe I might be projecting about him.

Thanks for writing, ST!

Take care, all.

Happy Tuesday Pud,

Just catching up with you on the last couple of days.



It's great that you're in a place where you not only realize this, but are actively making attempts to change.
I'm just arriving @ the place where I'm a little more comfortable letting my actual emotions show through.
Like you said, it doesn't have to be a long winded event, short & sweet is probably better suited to you.





I'm with ST on this, I think he still isn't believing the changes....yet.





It's this that separates the LBS from the WAS, isn't it! Not always easy to keep in mind, even with the knowledge, when what you want to do is "just give up and get some rest".

That's where I admire your decision to keep what's at stake in mind & hang in there.

L&L,

Sunny

Hi Puddle
Nothing really to add.

C

Hey Sunny!

Nice to hear from you. I've been wondering how you're doing! What's up on the roller coaster?



That's so funny. I really am not seeing it. How is it possible to live with someone, know them pretty well, and still not see things that seem obvious to others? I feel like I see other people's sitchs pretty clearly, too.




Yep, this is the big difference. Honestly, though, not sure how long I'll be willing to stick it out.



Yes, what's at stake. I have to keep remembering this. When our first child was born, H and I used to complain to each other about how hard it was, blah blah blah, then one would remind the other, "Yeah, but thankfully it's not about you." It was about the kids. Still is.

Hey CVA! Thanks for stopping by. I appreciate the support you're giving by just showing up.

H has been pressing hard on the money stuff, wanting to get everything figured out. I realized it brings me down a bit, but had a little talk with myself and told me to get it together. This is about my future, and I need to grab it by the horns and take control instead of sitting around thinking, oh ugh, this is going to be awful. I remembered Heim saying I'm driving; I need to drive.

H has taken the kids to dinner with COW and her sister. I had to laugh when the other guy said it's too bad he can't hang out with the three of us. We'd never discussed it; he just assumed it's inappropriate. I thought I might tell him if he promises never to touch me, we can, since that's H and my agreement: friends only. Decided to leave that open instead---never know what'll happen down the line. Of course H may end up with COW sometime, too, and in that case I assume he'll argue, "Hey, they already know her, what's the difference?" I'll stick to the agreement, though. All that tells me is that I'm leaving the door open for this guy, sometime.

H asked me if we could switch nights this week. I said, sorry, I have plans, but then said I'd check to see if I could rearrange. My friend was amenable, so we switched. H's response: "Hey, cool!" I almost emailed back, "You're welcome," but decided against it.

And we did get a sitter for Friday, so we'll talk. I emailed him about that and wrote, "Get ready to par-tay!" Just having fun. No reaction from him.

I'm going to my very first ever yoga class tonight! Very exciting.

Thanks, as ever, for the support, people. Take care.

Hi Puddle,
How did you like the yoga class? I started going a few weeks ago and I've really enjoyed it (except for downward facing dog!)