Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums We're separated--What Now? Thoughts on phone calls

HI Bryan
I have the same issue almost. Mine drops by whenever he wants and yesterday when we swapped our S he said he was going to take out the a/c unit for me next week and change the oil in my car. He has know for 3 weeks that I need my oil changed and has not mentioned it but he did yesterday and then said "unless you already had it done" which I had not since I honestly had not thought too much about it. So I believe that is a step forward but it could not be too. I am trying not to figure him out and just go with the flow but then he does something like that and I am all confused again.

As for this weekend I do not think it would be wise to try to get an answer out of her. I think you may have to wait until she is ready to tell you straight out. That will only push her and you may not hear what you want to hear and that could be a step back for you. You may want to just go with things for a bit right now.

Lissie: I understand why it doesn't sound like a good idea. I'm tired of being confused with her. I've been a really good and supportive friend to her over the past couple of weeks, she's been able to lean on me whenever she wants. I was and am fine with that as long as we were dating, which is what she told me a couple of weeks ago. Or if not dating then at least holding, not sliding back, not going forward; that would be OK too. Two nights ago, it sounded like we're definetly going back and if that's the case, I'm not going to be her BFF anymore; I can't be because it's too difficult for me to do that and still proceed with D.

Plus, and maybe this is bad to admit, I'm angry because I feel like I've been led on here. She said things and did things during my visit and afterwards that indicated she still has strong feelings for me. Then the past two nights she's made comments indicating that we're going to D. I understand that she's probably confused too and that would be fine if it weren't for the hearing date three weeks away, proceeding with which seems to have become her default setting. I'm a nice guy with a good job and no obvious defects; I deserve someone who at the very least respects me. If that's not her, and this pattern of behavior indicates it may not be, then I want to know that so I can push on.

I'll be the first to admit that this is not DB thinking. I'm angry and frustrated and hurt and disappointed and hopeless. And I feel stuck in a cycle where she gives me hope with one hand and takes it away with the other. The whole time this is happeneing, I'm getting the sensation that she's moving us cloer to the D while I haven't been paying attention. Like a magic trick, I've been watching the hand that says "yes, I still care for you" while the other hand is pulling the strings on ending the marriage. I'm tired of being yo-yo'd. If that makes me weak or not zen enough to sucessfully do DB, then OK.

Detaching from hurt, without detatching from your marriage, is really difficult.
In some ways, saying things about "how to do it", is almost a waste of time... each person kinda has to find out how to quiet their feelings themselves... but I'll share my thoughts on it anyway

For me, detaching comes, from a combination of a few things.
[I should point out that this list is from the perspective of being separated. Married couples still living together, may have a different take on things]

• Accepting that you cannot "control" your spouse, or "make" them do anything
• Accepting that, yes, they may decide to never come back. So you'd better get your life in order to handle that
• Accepting that a good marriage comes from when both parties WANT to be in it. And that's not what they want right now
• Reading, and through that, knowing that sometimes, backing off, is a kind of "doing something", that is more productive than anything you can "actively" do.
• Dropping expectations, that they "have to" work on your marriage. Clearly, they don't have that view, so your own personal viewpoint on that issue, is irrelevant.
• Accepting that there will be "up" days, and there will be "down" days. If you expect that an "up" is going to last.. the "down" will hurt you that much worse. So... dont "expect".

I think that, in summary, maybe it's about accepting that you cant force the two of you back together, or make it happen significantly faster by "rushing" things. (recognizing the times when you have rushed things, and made things WORSE, helps a whole lot here )

It's about giving the power over your relationship to your spouse. Accepting that all you can do, is be the best you that you can be, and letting them decide what to do about it. In their own time.

[please note: 'you', used above, is a generic]

Thank you Dom. It is different for everyone but hearing your approach at least gives me some clue as to where my path is.

Dom, that was a great post. There are a lot of us here right now that need to read it over and over and apply it's principals.

yet another question: what are your thoughts on pictures? Immediately after the seperation, I went around and collected all the pics of W and me around the house and took them down. I set them on her desk for her to take when she comes to get her stuff in a couple of weeks. Now, with things moving in a slighty more positive direction, I know that I need to put some of them back especially so that if she ever comes to my place, she sees them. But I'm not sure I want them out all the time to remind me during those frequent periods of doubt I get. A friend has suggested that if I really want this to work, I'll put them out and leave them out but I don't know if I can handle that so I was thinking that I'll have some here and put them out when I know W is in town in case she comes over. Thoughts?

I talked to W today and two new things:
1- I told about some people I met in Vegas who offered their house to me anytime I was back in town and she said "We'll have to visit them and Sara (one of her friends out there) if we ever go". First time she mentioned plans for the future for both of us. Felt good and I let it slide without comment. I'm not sure if I'm reading too much into that though as it was off hand and followed up by #2 below.
2- She told me she got hit on by a guy in Tractor Supply, twice by the same guy working there on different trips, and that it made her feel good. This is something that I would normally not take well but I joked with her about getting picked up in the Tractor Supply. Seemed to go over well. She tries to push my buttons a lot and I think maybe this was another one of those times, even if she didn't realize she was doing it. I think I handled it well although it really does bother me that she throws stuff like that out like I don't have feelings. She's told me all through our marriage what she wants in a husband and it's basically the things were all trying to do here: confident, not-clingy, caring, etc. Now that I'm doing those things (to one extent or another) I guess I'm a little disappointed that she doesn't seem to recognize it. Or maybe i is registering with her, she's just not letting me see it. God, I really hate these stupid mind games. I wish we could just be open and honest with each other and I could tell how much I want to be her H. but, if wishes were horses and all that.

I must be getting impatient or something because at first it felt natural to be upbeat and joking with her and now it's getting harder because I don't feel like I'm getting any kind of reassurance from her that this is working. Sure, there are good comments like the one above but there's also the "we're probably going to D" comment from Wednesday that wipes most of those out.

This might sound like reaching but I know, absolutely know, that she doesn't want a D. She's fed up with how things are, hopeless that we can actually change and that's what's driving the D talk from her, not an honest loss of feeling for me. She's also looking at her new job and house as a fresh start and this must seem like the perfect time to D since I'm completely disentangled from her life. I wish I could reach into her head and brush those cobwebs away because it seems like she's so close sometimes to being my W again and I just want to get there *now*.

she's not treating you like you dont have feelings. She's TESTING YOU, to try to gauge what your feelings are.

I think that different women might be testing for different things.
Yours might have been testing for signs of "non-clingy".
if so, then what you are doing, HAS registered with her. You just need a third person's perspective to interpret.



Or.. you could just have faith, and patience, and keep doing what you are doing.

If you "expect" a payoff from her... it will dampen your positive attitude. It seems like doing this stuff, always takes longer to keep at to REALLY "work", than is motivated by just a selfish "I want to see a response" drive.

Which, in some ways, is perfectly justified behaviour by the other side. They want to see if what you are doing is a permenant change, rather than just a "I'mk going to do this just until we patch things up, and if we dont, then I'll stop".

if you stop what you are doing because you dont see an emotional "payback"... then you havent really changed, eh?

That's a good point about the testing Dom, thank you. I guess I know why she does what she does but it really does help to have it acknowledged by a third party. I wonder if it counts as a valid test if I still have those clingy type feelings when she says those things but I don't act on them? Is that real change or am I just lying to myself by stuffing the feelings down? I don't know yet. I'd like to think that what I'm doing is allowing us to get back to a place where she doesn't feel she has to say those things and if she does every once in a while, I can handle those because I see how infrequent they are.

I've been kind of down for the past week or so which I'm logically looking at as a good sign. I've heard that detachment is usually preceeded by a drop in PMA and I think that's what's been going on. Anyway, that's why the whinning in my previous post. I know this isn't easy and I know that it really shouldn't be, anything worth having is worth working for. I was just venting some of my frustration at the time. I appreciate the honest look.

Still debating this question from above if anyone has any thoughts on it.

Talked to W again two nights ago and it was very positive. Got a maybe for my brothers wedding in two weeks (I'm the best man ) and an interestd maybe in retrouvaille at the end of October. I think one of the things that's really helped me recently has been all the problems W has had with work. She's been calling me almost every night and venting about it and it's been a good oppurtunity for me to showcase some increased compassion and faith in her abilities. The best thing is, I really enjoy being there for her, something that used to get old for me very quickly. Sucks that she has to go through this but I am a pretty spiritual person and I can defintely see a Larger Hand in this, providing oppurtunities for us to re-connect.

The best thing right now is that I feel pretty positive but also pretty detached. I hope she wants to work this out but I can also see that my life will be pretty good either way. I'm still lonely from time to time, that's probably the biggest problem I'm dealing with right now, the hours of silence around the house. Going out almost makes it worse because it seems like all I see are happy couples walking around holding hands. But, I know that someday I will have that again so I feel like I can wait. Hopefully with W but if not, something else will fall into place.

I told W last night that this sep has been a good thing and I really believe that. I've had these things inside of me for years that have needed attention but I never did anything about them. With the M in the crapper and nothing left to lose I thought what the heck and tried to grow beyond my self imposed limitations and the feeling of personal empowerment, of feeling like my happiness is not tied to fate, is unreal.