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WAW
Felt the same thing this weekend. Sat down, on the Garage floor, after just running around till I was exhausted doing things, thinking, WTF, I am so underappreciated and when her friends or family call its like, "Oh hi!!!, great to talk to you, all smiles and laughter" and I get nada!

Sounds like a frustrating weekend all around the boards.

AND NO, YOU ARE NOT #2 or anything below #1. For cryin out loud, you are 29 yrs old and have a lot to offer. You have to believe that. Please stamp this thought to your forehead, ok?

WAW1978,

Sorry to be negative as well, but after all we are pretty much in the same place.


These thoughts of yours really hit home for me. I've been thinking a whole lot about older couples that I know. On the outside it appears that things are and have always been wonderful. But, if you know the real story behind their sitch you will usually find things haven't always been a bed of roses. For example, I know a couple H was abusive, W had affairs (which came first? I don't know) in any case they spent 25+ years married with multiple separations. In the process they raised 2 screwed up kids and the marriage finally ended in divorce. Another couple unhappy marriage, wife had affair but came back, lost a child, and are still married although not seemingly happy. Examples like this make me wonder if it is not better to just walk away and start over. Even if we make it, 1)will we have screwed up our kids in the process, and 2)will we truly be happy or settling for a life of pretend.

I guess I'm questioning whether or not it is realistic to think that my H and I can ever have that happy ever after relationship that I thought I was getting when we got married after everything that has happened.

WAW1978 - You are better than #5, and if your H doesn't think you are worth fighting for then you don't need him, but give him time. He may be just as miserable on the BIG Trip as you are sitting at home. Sounds like he has a lot of pride and you'd be the last to know how miserable he is.......

Thank you everyone. I know I deserve to be #1. I just don't think H can let go of his family enough to let that happen. His attachment to his family and not being able to live his own life is a big part of our problems. He has only been to IC twice during this 3 months.

I would have enjoyed any sign that he was sorry. As they say talk is cheap. So its actions that would have to show me he really is sorry for how he treated me. I don't know, maybe him showing me support when he sees me crying or knows I hurting. There is a difference between pushing and being a caring individual. Maybe not being a vindictive bastard about possesions, custody of our child & dog...even this latest crap where he gave me back the savings that he had absconded and put in a safe, of course minus my half of the money for the trip.

I guess this is just one of those weeks. We all feel like giving up from time to time and I guess its just my turn. Its different now being in my own space. Even though I am lonely as hell when my daughter isn't there. I am trying to GAL. Going to join a local gym and try to meet new people. I moved back to my home town after 11 years. Weird but its not that easy to reconnect with people. Everyone is sort of doing there own thing. Word of my separation has spread like wildfire. Seems like the small town scuttlebuck is still alive & well.

WAW 1978, I need some advice. W is having seperation papers drawn but said she does not want D. Moving out in Oct. wants to get div. of property out of the way and sett. so we can go to C. and work on our proplems.She will be takeing our kids S3,D6 with her. I believe she is sincere in what she says, she needs the space to find out if she can live the rest of her life with me and raise our two kids together. Says she needs to find out if i love her for her or i want her around just for the kids am i sincere about loving her. What do i need to do. Ive dbing all i can. need advice.

Hi WAW -

Been meaning to respond to you for a while, but got delayed. A few quick thoughts for you.



I guess it could be, but I seriously doubt it. Maybe he is detaching, and maybe in part he is finally giving you the time and space you need to figure some things out. And maybe he is trying to figure some things out for himself.



Again, I seriously doubt it. But I can tell you he probably feels hurt by all that is happening. He probably sees your needing time and space as meaning you don't care for or love him. So he may be retreating to lick his wounds, or even saying "to hell with her." I know I feel some of that. Don't try to read his mind too much. You can't be sure so don't waste time trying. It can just hurt you and your PMA.



Good.



Maybe, but how can you know. Question: You don't want to give yourself false hope, so why give yourself false despair. (This applies to flipside as well, I think. )



Again, maybe true, but you don't know.



Again, I know how you are feeling. I am feeling a lot of this too. But neither of us knows what will come from a real, good faith effort at change by us and our spouses.



I believe this, I'm sorry, and I agree you deserve better.



Again, with all due respect, that possible future is not reality. Just a possibility. Maybe a very likely possibility. But not set in stone. No way, no how.



Look for baby steps. Isn't he backing off some? Isn't he going to MC, and now some IC? What else? Give him some credit if it's due.

Hugs,
Nomo

Hey WAW, I have been reading your thread and I may not be totally up to speed in your situation so forgive me if I am off base here but this is my opinion on your situation.

It seems as if you started off as a WAW, and your husband DB'd the heck out of you (basically turned the tables) He showed that he was not about to chase you, and he continued on with his life.

This took you out of your position as a WAW and he is now the WAH, He has all the power because you are the one who wants him back. My gut feeling on all of this is that if you get to the point that you are totally sincere, in moving on with your life, even if it means finding someone else and totally detaching, your husband will have a change of heart.

It is a very dangerous move, but you have already lost your position as the WAW, you want to save this marriage more than him, which gives him all the power, and as a man I think he knows this. I believe he know how much you are hurting, and wants you to come back begging. The fact that you hurt gives him the strength to keep detaching.

You have to turn the tables, my wife did this to me, I was fed up with her trying to change me, and I would throw comments telling her to leave if she wanted too.

Guess what, one day she did and it rocked my world, she totally detached from me, and I got what I asked for. I don't think she ever had any intention of giving me another chance but things seem to be looking up for me. I now see the error of my ways, and am becoming a better person.

You have to really detach, your husband is in control and men love control, I know I did. My wife snatched that control away from me so fast it made my head spin, and it woke me up. I think its time that you give your husband a wake up call, you seem to be down to your last straw, and maybe the after LRT card needs to be played.

Confuzd

Hope I am not being too harsh, but let me go a little further. (And I totally understand having one of those weeks, so feel free to ignore. Just trying to help, really.)



This is not an easy thing for him to fix. He may never do it, but he might. Just like you need time and space to heal, he needs time and space to discover and fix his issues. Patience is needed all around. "Keep hope alive!" (Did I just quote Jesse Jackson?)



Again, it may take him a while to realize this or be able to express it. He may feel so hurt he can't apologize yet.



I can tell you right now that when my W is upset I really don't know if she wants me to support her. Remember, she has basically told me she may walk away. In other words, she may not want me in her life. Why should I think she wants me to comfort her? The whole reason is that the point of our S is for her to decide if she is happier without me. My point to you, WAW, is that it's hard for everyone in these sitches to see what the other side is thinking/feeling, so don't assume things that may be obvious to you are obvious to your LBS.



Can you validate why your H may be feeling vindicitve? Can you empathize?

Confuzd, wanted to respond to your post too:



I think this is off base a bit. Her H hasn't really DB'd her at all. Now he may have stopped chasing (in other words backing off). And maybe the power is shifting a little. WAW did say she felt maybe her H had given up and moved on, and expressed some concern/hurt over that possibility. But to say the roles have reversed where he is the WAS and she is the LBS is, IMO, a lot more unlikely than likely. He may be detaching. He may be moving on. But it could be a lot more than that. (Could be, I stress. We can't really know, I don't think.) He could be giving her the time and space she needs. He could be realizing that he doesn't control the sitch, and may be trying to not control things. He could be focusing on himself. It isn't clear. Personally, I doubt seriously he has moved on.

Now, for WAW1978, I think you should continue to focus on you (and what you want for you and your D). That's really what we all have to do. And I would strive to interact with H, when you do, the best you can. Be as pleasant as you can. But give him time, space and patience too. And I would not give up on MC or IC as it happens. Hopefully he will learn, grow, come around. This is not any easier for him than it is for you or any of us.

Just my 2 cents. Hope it helps.

Big hugs,
Nomo

WAW1978 --

Nomo makes some really great points here...

And Nomo,
powerful words for ALL of us to take to heart, whichever role we're in.

L

Gee LL,

Maybe I should listen to myself, huh??

Nomo

Nomo, everyone,

Generally, I agree with everything you've said. We can't know what the other side is thinking. However, go back and reread WAW's post from 8/30 (I think it's on page 9). She's dealing with a borderline (or outright) emotionally abusive spouse.

Yes, technically, she's a WAW. However, read another way, she had to leave to remain her own person. Maybe I sympathize with WAW too much because I've seen my mom have to put up with variants of this type of jealous/controlling behavior when I was a kid. Plus, SHE is the one trying to save the M and do all of the work -- JUST LIKE A LBS!

Plus, her H's controlling behavior hasn't changed -- putting their money into a safe and returning it but with a portion taken out to cover her half of a trip, keeping a dog he doesn't really like, controlling access to their D, etc.

Nomo/GD/CVA, honestly, were any of you EVER this controlling? I know that people can and do have changes of heart, but I have a hard time envisioning either of you displaying the utter contempt for your spouse that WAWs H has shown towards her.

Nomo,

Another interpretation is that he's still trying to control her. He knows she wants to work on the M, but is attempting to control access to the things she loves -- D, dog, him -- in an attempt to get her to return without having to look at himself and changing HIS behavior. From what WAW has said, he's still refusing to move from his comfort zone. More below on that.

Have always loved this sentiment:

Something we should all remember.

WAW, don't give up yet, because, deep down, I really don't think you want to. As I posted earlier, build and show your H some inner strength. If it's too much for him, you're better off. But, as Nomo correctly pointed out, he may surprise the hell out of you -- in a good way. Maybe you moving out, living life on your terms, and becoming stronger will be the 2x4 he needs to knock some sense into him. If not, well, his loss.

And, yes, Nomo, you should listen to yourself. You're pretty good at this

BD

Hang in there,

BD