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That is an excellent revelation. I think it's good you were truthful with your parents. Sending her a copy was a very bold move. I hope she appreciates it. I also agree that getting some support from your religious background is a good idea. I hope you do feel better. Feeling like a woman with PMS does suck. It's not a good thing for a man!

((DaveJ))

Just work on detaching, it will help get you off the rollercoaster and over to the sidelines.

Damn right! Now, as Nikki says, work on detaching and don't push her. Start showing her how good of a person you can be. Don't tell her. She'll notice.

BD

Yeah, it's like now I have a goal and a purpose. I am pumped. Talked to W tonight. Seems pretty positive. She is happy that I finally have a different attitude. I told her that I'm not going to just lay down with this. She means everything to me and I will go down fighting. I will not lose her. That is just unacceptable to me. Maybe my PMA will influence her a little and get her out of her down. She has been pretty mad at me for "ruining" her family visit by talking about R. So she stops saying ILY cuz she's mad at me. Talk about women holding a grudge. I'd never stop saying that even if I'm mad at her. That's how I feel no matter what. Oh well I digress. She seems to be in a much better mood and even laughing a bit at the end of the conversation. So I guess that's good. Still no ILY but oh well. Doesn't bother me as much as before. She's probably still a bit upset with me.

I swear I feel like I am on a sugar high or something. Of course it does help when you actually eat food. I do hope she appreciates the letter. I sure meant every word I said in there. Mom called after reading the email, was very supportive. That's a surprise. She says I'm just like my father and basically that whole side of the family. Never think about other people much. I confess I have been in a bubble and not thinking about the W which got me in this hole in the first place. She also blamed a bit on herself for not teaching me "people skills". Ah well, I learned it the hard way myself and hope it's not too late.

I'm not really religious at all. Agnostic. But on the way to Homedepot in order to recollect my sanity this afternoon I decided that I could be open to that. If I take care of myself, maybe God will take care of the rest. So I will just work on me and let go of control for anything else. I will trust in God to take care of me if I work on myself. That's detaching right? Just focus on me and the kids. I don't even feel so distraught not seeing the kids for so long anymore. I will look forward to them coming home on Tues, but I'm not gonna go crazy over it just cuz they aren't here right now.

I just want to thank everyone for their continuous support and words of wisdom. I couldn't have held onto my sanity without you guys. So thanks! Here's hoping that my PMA continues, I win back my W, and I never have to go down the path of D if I can help it.

Yes, don't tell her. Your words are no good. Be the man you want to be. Get happier with you. If your W notices great! If not yu know how wonderful you are.

"Here's hoping that my PMA continues, I win back my W, and I never have to go down the path of D if I can help it."


That's a good toast. I'll drink to that!

Had a session with Jody this morning. Gave me a lot of insight on what I should and need to do. Didn't realize that in order to give her space it's going to be that hard. Visiting the kids is like knowing she's there but I can only treat her as a friend not as a wife and minimal contact. That is going to be a tough one. Originally we planned 3 times a week I have dinner with the family and put kids to bed. But apparently that's bad and I shouldn't have dinner with the family. It sabotages what we are trying to do, which is giving her space. Uck! The S is going to be a lot harder than I imagined. I can do this! I will do this! If I am to save my M I need to get through this. Man do I wish there's a local support group of DBers around.

I know this feeling well, but it's a REALLY unhealthy one both for you and W. She's not a posession to be won or lost. She's a human being who wants and deserves to be happy, just like you do. It's not your responsibility to make her happy, but you do have to figure out how to make yourself happy and how to be a strong person all on your own. Then you get to hope she does the same, and that you can work on a better M.



Yep, hopefully your PMA will help - but remember it's for you, not to control her.

You may want to look at the ILY thing from another angle. Every time you say it, you're putting pressure on her to say it back. And reminding her that she doesn't want to say it back, because she doesn't feel that way right now (ouch, sorry). Yes it's how you feel, but right now you need to be careful how much of your feelings you're sharing with her.

Glad you met with Jody, sounds like she gave you a lot of very sound advice.

Yes, this is going to be harder than you can imagine, and take longer than you'd ever believe. Be patient, keep detaching and working on you.

Dave.. I appreciate your situation. it's a nasty and difficult thing, to try to "win back" a WAW.

I've been separated for over a year now.
I have 3 short things to say.

1. Dont move out

2. Dont move out

3 DONT MOVE OUT

Yeah, she'll throw a hissy if you change your mind now.
but better that she get all pissed at you now, then you drop the chances of you ever recovering your marriage by 80% or something horrible, if you actually physically separate.

I'm sure she'll give you lots of reasons why you "have" to separate, and YOU "have" to move out.
Just say words to the tune of, "I hear what you are saying. I'm sorry you feel that way. After thinking deeply over the past few weeks about our situation, I have a different opinion on what is the best thing to do in this situation" .

Obviously, she still has the option to move out herself.
She may do so, particularly if she's still dating someone else. She may decide at that point, to threaten you with legal action of filing separation/divorce. (so that you'll finance her while she's out there, and dating whoever)

My advice to you, is to stand firm.

It is next to impossible to work on your marriage well, when you are separated. Avoid it as much as possible, and if it comes down to it, do not give validation to the idea by you being the one to move out.


keep in mind that, "I need space", is almost always a mask for, "I dont want you to see what I really am up to/want to be doing".

Also, the more comfy you make separation, the more you validate her WAW inside, looking for proof that "see? divorce will be JUST FINE!"

This is possibly just a trial run to see how a divorce will be. If it's comfy enough for her, then next comes divorce. Dont go down that road. If you love your children, or your wife, dont do it.

If she truely wants "time to herself", etc. then she could have a separate room in the house to do [whatever].
Usually, when a spouse wants their partner OUT OF THE HOUSE, it's so that they can date, etc., seems like.
Or at the very least, as a dry run for divorce.

No, I know she wants some time to think. There is no other person or dating involved. According to Jody this could jump start our marriage. She needs time to think and to sort out everything without me being there. She also need to miss me. If I'm always there, it probably gives her anxiety and pressure. Until she can feel that she's independent and not being "controlled" by me, she won't be thinking about working on our M. I already did the I won't move out thing. She gave it a 3 months try before she decided that she wants a D. So if I pull that crap she will file the papers. No ifs or buts. At least this gives me a chance to my M. With me being there my M isn't going anywhere forward. She's not happy and she isn't willing to work on it to make the M better. Plus, this is what she wants and it shows that I am listening to her needs.

The bottom line is that I know my W and I will trust her on this. And yes, even after the EA. It was a "special" circumstance that is now over. If she truly misses me and wants this M then she will turn around in the end. If not, nothing in the world I can do to stop her or change her mind. I have given up trying to control everything. I can only control myself and strive to make things better for me and my kids. I need to have faith in her to have hope that the M will turn around. And yes it may be a dry run for divorce. And believe me our kids will make it REALLY hard for her to like the situation. Right now she feels comfort with me around. Well, we'll remove that comfort and see what happens. The whole point is to show her that even though she thinks she may want D, it's a much pleasant and happier life with me than w/o me. I will do everything I can to prove those stats wrong. It's 70%. But I will be the 30%. If it's such a sure thing then it'd be 100%. In the end I know that at least I gave it my best shot and did everything I can. No regrets.