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Right on, girl!!! Let us repeat together "we will not allow the fear to grip our hearts nor allow our minds to think we cannot live w/o them!!" Oh and this one too "THEY should be as thankful to have US as we are to have them and if they aren't, well scr*w 'em!!"

CM,
I keep telling myself that I can live without him. One of these days it will sink in. I'm getting closer, but not quite there yet.


Did anyone happen to watch the Oprah Show today? It was about infidelity. The first couple -- H cheated with best friend's wife. OW also happened to be his W's best friend. The psychologist on there said that infidelity usually starts because our spouses have an unresolved hurt in his/her childhood, so they take the pain out on their spouses. After much prodding he revealed that he was mad at his dad because he never listened to his mother or him and that he was very arrogant.

My DD's 16&19 came in the den while I was watching and wanted to know what it was about and ended up watching also. My D19 made the comment this makes me never want to get married. I looked at both of my DD's faces during this time to see how it was affecting them. I saw both of them rub their eyes. I know they were thinking about their dad. I started to ask them if they wanted to change the channel, but I figured if they didn't want to watch they would have asked to change it or left the room. It's so sad that my H and other cheaters have given my D such a poor outlook on marriage.

Also does anyone have any thoughts about my H taking DD's to lake on OW's b-day? I'm surprised that they didn't plan something big. Her son was out of town the whole weekend.

Yoyo--

I'm sorry about your daughters' unhappiness. I suppose that I would have imagined the hurt to be strongest among the younger children... but from talking to a friend of mine (whose parents divorced when she was 18), I realize how traumatic it is for the teenagers, as well--perhaps more so. In my friend's case, her dad hung the moon. But he left his family, and his children's respect, for an ultimately short-lived affair with a girl his daughters' age.

He's a lonely old man now, ailing, and dependent on his successful daughters, who do their duty by him, but still feel bitter.

Now there's a cheerful story.

As to your H taking his daughters to the lake--maybe he just likes their company better. If OW is the type to monopolize him, to the point that he feels she is undermining his relationship with his children, her neediness could create the same kind of distancing that he must once have shown you, in your distress.

Oh, and yes, our time lines are very similar. My H moved out last October, Friday the Thirteenth. D filed in June.

I keep thinking I've detached, have moved on. But, though it's getting a lot better, I'm not there yet. Every time he shows up to pick up the kids (and he sees them about a total of 8 hours a month--lame, lame), I feel a great urge to go out and visit a liquor store.

Hi Delia,
M H moved out on Oct. 23. I found out later that OW served her H with papers on Oct 26. I got my papers on June 15. So our timelines are so close.

Wow, I got a kick in the gut tonight the OW's H called tonight and told me that he picked his son up today for the weekend. His son told him that he, his mother and half-sister went to my H's parents to watch fireworks. Wow, what a happy little family. Neither of my DD's were invited. H knew that oldest DD was cooking out with friends and youngest was going to Hot Springs for the day. Youngest D was back in town by 7:00 plenty of time to watch fireworks, but he never called and checked to see if she was back. By the way the fireworks they watched happend to be be the city wide fireworks. You can see them from in-laws's yard. There are always several people there, so I guess now they don't care who sees them.

Delia, it seems my H is headed down the same path of losing his daughters. I know what you mean about the liquor store.

Found you, Yoyo. Gee, I was only gone for 4 days, but now have lots of reading to catch up on. Just wanted to say I am thinking of you.

Matilda

I just got home about 30 min. ago from my DD's church softball games. The season started tonight. She had 3 games tonight. H called oldest DD to see where they were playing and said he wasn't go to ride out there to watch her. When I got there I looked around and didn't see him. This is a multiplex. During the game DD came out of the dugout and sat in my lap and asked me to rub her back. Yes, my 16 year old baby, ha. I told her that her dad had called her sister and asked about the games. I said did he ever come? She said yeah, see he is in his truck parked by the fence straight ahead. He sat in his truck during all games and never came in the field. Is he ashamed or what? It is so nice to be able to walk among people in our community and not worry that they are going to talk about me, I assume he thinks this would happen to him. Otherwise, why wouldn't he come in the fence? I honestly think DD made a point to be affectionate to me in front of her dad. I love my DD's so much, they are my lifeline!

I like that image--you and your 16-year-old baby. She already has the true instincts of a woman.

I think that your H MUST be ashamed. It can't be very comfy to sit in a truck in the middle of a southern summer night--unless you're in the mountains.

The sense of shame might account for what seems to be an effort to keep his daughters and OW separate from each other (I'm thinking of the fireworks party, when they had no invites). I know that my H practically ties himself into pretzels trying to protect his beloved from the hostility of DD11. She's been too grilled in politeness to SAY anything, but I have a strong suspicion that she LOOKS daggers.

My H hasn't bought anything for the children for Christmas, Easter, or their birthdays, but before their first meeting with OW, he took them to the toy store, the book store, and the ice cream store. Subtle.

You and I stay up way too late, YoYo.

Delia,
I'm such a night owl. I'm a teacher so I have the summers off. I like to stay up late and sleep in.

My H has always been good about letting me get the girls things, but since this has happened it's amazing how much money he gives them. Youngest DD has no qualms about asking him for money. It's sad, but she always says " I deserve it for what he has put me through."

I too think he must be ashamed. It's nice to know that he still has somewhat of a conscience left.

So you think my DD knew what she was doing? Gotta love her. She is the one that has far more outspoken with her dad. She told him that she thought he had treated me shi%%y and she knew about OW. Yes, I know young ladies shouldn't talk like that, but I thought it was very appropriate for the situation. I had no idea that she had confronted him until about a week ago.

Do you have your own thread anywhere, I'd like to read it.

Yoyo

All young ladies talk that way when the hurt is bad enough. Sadly, my sheltered oldest has encountered a lot of new and nasty facts throughout the course of this business.

Her dad took it into his cotton-stuffed skull one day to try to get me to agree to a D by some kind of sledge-hammer approach: bellowing at me the names of all the women he'd f***ed in the last few years---where, when, and how. All this in the living room, with the kids in bed close by, not even asleep....I look up, and there's DD11 in pajamas peeping in, looking...indescribable.

It's craziness. He's not a bad man, but the very worst of his nature is on display. I still find it truly shocking--and I'm no gem myself.

When our oldest was born, she was in intensive care for a week, and H and I spent every night sleeping in the waiting room of the hospital. Neither one of us, at that time, could ever have imagined such a scene eleven years later.

Glad you've got an outspoken daughter. She will indeed make H feel ashamed. He ought to feel shame. Shame is underrated!

I haven't got a thread. I was thinking of posting one with a collection of OW's poetry, in case there were any literary critics, or psychiatrists, on the boards to interpret them. But that would be kinda mean. Also, it's not really good for me to keep obsessing over the little doofus.

I'll know I'm truly cured when I can sincerely wish H and Doofus well. Creeping along, but not there yet.

delia

we are all not like your H. trust me on this one. I will do everything in my power to protect my son. even if it makes me unhappy. at least for the next 8 years


husband