Are you really being tough on yourself? I mean I understand this is a big decision for you. I understand you feel you are doing the right thing, but how are you being tough on yourself?
And does that last post make it easier for you to leave? Does that help you in believing that?
By "tough" I meant making myself do what I believe I need to do in SPITE of my fears and anxieties.
I believe I need to step away from the M and focus on who I really am and what I really want, because while I'm in the M, I resort to old, self-destructive behaviors very quickly. I've been living like a frightened child all my life. And so has my H. We have a LOT in common there.
We met and married primarily out of fear and neediness. What enchanted me when I met him was how much he was NOT like my XH and how wonderful that felt. And he loved how different I was from his XW. And that, my friends, is a lousy foundation.
Meanwhile, a friendship has developed, which I truly would like to preserve. What I'm not clear on is whether we both really want it to be in the form of a marriage.
...I guess I probably don't really belong on this board, right? I guess I'm hoping some time and space will allow us both to think more clearly.
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And does that last post make it easier for you to leave? Does that help you in believing that?
Honestly, I can't tell what he feels and thinks. It's just an insecure assumption of mine.
Have you determined what it is that your H does not provide for you? I hear you talking about what you don't like and it feels like you're missing quality time (your love language perhaps?)
Let's look at your EA for instance, what did OM give you that H did not? Quality conversation, quality time, he let you get your emotions out and he listened, right?
Your H has gotten boring, he spends his time killing it with meaningless activities, while he should have been spending the time with you, right?
Have you told him that in clear terms? Not in hints and suggestion, but in clear terms that a man would understand. For example, "Honey, the time you spend on the internet could be better spent talking to me, I would really like that. Could we schedule 30 minutes a day to just sit on the couch and talk?"
If he doesn't agree to that, and doesn't do it, well then you have proof he's not too interested in making things better. But if all you've done is make faces at him or made veiled insults at the time he spends on the internet or doing Sudoku, or whatever, he's not getting that and he's not ignoring you, he did not HEAR you.
I know of what I speak because I was your husband for the last 3 years up til 3 months ago. I hope that your leaving hits your H in the head with a brick like my W leaving did to me.
I'm working on getting my W out of being scared - it's a huge challenge, but we're coming along VEEEEERY slowly.
We can talk ourselves into defeat or we can talk ourselves into victory - we are creatures of our thinking.
3/31/07 - Hit with a brick, leaving the dent there...
You seem to have the right answers. You have put a lot of thought into this. It comes across in the posts. Being the one WAS, you should have a plan of what you want. If not, it just seems like MLC. Do you have some short term goals and long term goals as to what you want to happen? Not that it matters, but it would make it easier for other people to understand where you are. And that it's not MLC. It is something you have thought about and come to grips with.
Most of us on here are quick to blame the WAS with having MLC. Or, they do not understand what they are doing. Or, they are giving up on M because of their on insecurities. I know for me, I would like to understand why it's not worth staying and working on. I need someone who left to try and explain what my WAS may be thinking. i know it is two different situations, but maybe there is a litlle similarity in them that would give me some insight. Because I am not getting from her.
You seem to have the right answers. You have put a lot of thought into this. It comes across in the posts. Being the one WAS, you should have a plan of what you want. If not, it just seems like MLC. Do you have some short term goals and long term goals as to what you want to happen? Not that it matters, but it would make it easier for other people to understand where you are. And that it's not MLC. It is something you have thought about and come to grips with.
Most of us on here are quick to blame the WAS with having MLC. Or, they do not understand what they are doing. Or, they are giving up on M because of their on insecurities. I know for me, I would like to understand why it's not worth staying and working on. I need someone who left to try and explain what my WAS may be thinking. i know it is two different situations, but maybe there is a litlle similarity in them that would give me some insight. Because I am not getting from her.
That's a great point. I'm more apt to chalk it up to boredom. Nothing kills a relationship for a woman like boredom. And not having basic emotional needs met (I like to use the love languages, but I'm sure there are other ways to explain it too) leads quickly to boredom. That's why EA's and PA's are so common. Another person just made things interesting again. It's also why we as the LBS's have a chance IF we step up and create real attraction again AND provide the things that keep our spouses feeling loved.
Towanda, I know you feel a bit out of place, but please stick around. Your insights with regards to WAW's is super valuable and hopefully, we can provide you with some insight into your H's behaviors. Win/Win for all of us I hope.
We can talk ourselves into defeat or we can talk ourselves into victory - we are creatures of our thinking.
3/31/07 - Hit with a brick, leaving the dent there...
Let's look at your EA for instance, what did OM give you that H did not? Quality conversation, quality time, he let you get your emotions out and he listened, right?
Bingo! You're good!
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Have you told him that in clear terms? Not in hints and suggestion, but in clear terms that a man would understand. For example, "Honey, the time you spend on the internet could be better spent talking to me, I would really like that. Could we schedule 30 minutes a day to just sit on the couch and talk?"
If he doesn't agree to that, and doesn't do it, well then you have proof he's not too interested in making things better. But if all you've done is make faces at him or made veiled insults at the time he spends on the internet or doing Sudoku, or whatever, he's not getting that and he's not ignoring you, he did not HEAR you.
True, true all true. You're absolutely right. You caught me.
Now, here's the thing that gets me so confused though: we HAVE had those clear talks. Face to face. Lots of deep dialogue. Lots of promises. Over and over. I can accept that maybe it takes a few of them before they sink in. But nothing seemed to ever sink in and STAY there. Is that REALLY just a "guy" thing? I can't (don't want to) believe that all guys are THIS clueless.
Now, after the EA, he was a LOT better with this, even went to IC and MC. But then the cycle would start again. And repeat. And repeat. I can accept that changes take time, but I started wondering just how sincere he was after a couple of years of this dance.
I raise issue; we discuss; come to resolution; we implement. But EVERY time the ball was in HIS court, the ball got dropped. I got tired of being the only one picking up and carrying the ball.
Yes, maybe my leaving will be the cement block to the head. Bricks have had no effect. At least not for long.
It gets hard to believe he really wants me to stay. So, I have to consider the possibility that he's just protecting my feelings by saying what he thinks I want to hear, but not following through with action.
Here's another tidbit: Every time I declared I was leaving, his energy level would go up and he'd suddenly spend time on more meaningful, though still solitary, activities (woodworking, photography). Every time I changed my mind and decided not to leave, he'd take me back with open arms BUT go back to playing solitaire on the computer and stop the more productive stuff.
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I know of what I speak because I was your husband for the last 3 years up til 3 months ago. I hope that your leaving hits your H in the head with a brick like my W leaving did to me.
I'm curious: what went through your head when your W would try to give you clues before she finally left? (I'm assuming she did give you clues).
Not really, I'm just going through it from the other side.
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True, true all true. You're absolutely right. You caught me.
Now, here's the thing that gets me so confused though: we HAVE had those clear talks. Face to face. Lots of deep dialogue. Lots of promises. Over and over. I can accept that maybe it takes a few of them before they sink in. But nothing seemed to ever sink in and STAY there. Is that REALLY just a "guy" thing? I can't (don't want to) believe that all guys are THIS clueless.
If you have told him in NO uncertain terms. If you have told him that you want his time, quality time at least 30 minutes a day and you just want him to listen (I mean in these actual words) and he won't do it, or doesn't keep it up, there is one more thing to consider - have you met HIS love language. What do you think it is? When you do something, what is the thing you do that makes him the happiest, that helps him feel good and loved? Is it words of affirmation? Physical Touch? Giving Gifts? (we know it's not quality time ) Or Acts of service? If you have to take the first step and figure out what it is and make him feel loved so that he can do the same for you, well you have to determine if it's worth it for YOU to take the first step. I think the guy who wrote the book said do this for 90 days and re-evaluate (that may be a long time for you, again, you have to decide if it's worth it.) If you do that and you still get nothing, you may have nothing.
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Yes, maybe my leaving will be the cement block to the head. Bricks have had no effect. At least not for long.
It gets hard to believe he really wants me to stay. So, I have to consider the possibility that he's just protecting my feelings by saying what he thinks I want to hear, but not following through with action.
Here's another tidbit: Every time I declared I was leaving, his energy level would go up and he'd suddenly spend time on more meaningful, though still solitary, activities (woodworking, photography). Every time I changed my mind and decided not to leave, he'd take me back with open arms BUT go back to playing solitaire on the computer and stop the more productive stuff.
I'll tell you honestly, it does not sound like you've been as clear as you think. You have to be blunt, no doubt about what you want. For instance, think about ordering a meal at a fast-food restaurant - you tell them exactly what you want. Do the same with H, treat him like the big head at the local Jack in the Box. Ask him to repeat back what you've asked for and make sure he gets it. If he doesn't get it after that, he does not deserve you. If you can take the time to let him know what you want and he can't do it. He doesn't deserve you. OK?
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I'm curious: what went through your head when your W would try to give you clues before she finally left? (I'm assuming she did give you clues).
I had NO IDEA! I had told my W many, many times that I was so glad she didn't play games and use hints and passive-aggressive behavior to get what she wanted. When in fact, she was. I missed it all because I had convinced myself that W was as happy as I was in the marriage. She wasn't because I wasn't speaking her love language. She spoke mine many times, and I was content. I blew it and assumed she felt the same way. That was my brick to the head. As my sig says, I'm leaving the dent so I don't forget.
So, that's why I say, if you are not saying the exact thing that you want to your husband and stressing to him how important it is to you, he is not getting it. And if you do that, and he doesn't respond, he just may not care, and that's not fair to you. I would NOT expect my W to stick around after all this if I did not do VERY specific things to let her know how much I love her and how important and valuable she is to me and you should expect the same from your H. Make sense?
We can talk ourselves into defeat or we can talk ourselves into victory - we are creatures of our thinking.
3/31/07 - Hit with a brick, leaving the dent there...
