Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums THE SEX-STARVED MARRIAGE I need some understanding from the men out there.

Exactly. Tiredandlost hasn't posted back here yet, but if and when she does I hope we see some indication that that point is starting to sink in.

Excellent. I would fully endorse that approach as well.

Okay. Lost of interesting comments but I didn't think I read anything that addressed these issues brought up by tiredandlost:

Is there something with men only feeling closeness to their wives when they are ML? I should say sex, because my h is extremely kinky and this is just what if feels for me 90% of the time.

IS feeling closeness with your wife ONLY with sex a normal feeling? Please note I asked about ONLY sex. Of course sex/ML is a great way to feel closeness but I, as a woman, don't think it should be the ONLY way anymore than any ONE thing should be the ONLY way.

I feel that this is all he likes about me.

Can men understand that feeling that sex is the ONLY thing that an H would like in his wife would be an extreme turn-off to a woman? If your wife ONLY liked the paycheck you brought home, would that be acceptable if she was willing to put out when and where ever you requested? (Would that even really be a "marriage"?)

He can be very cruel at times

Should a wife be able and willing to have sex even if she is demeaned and insulted by her H?

just wanted to get some feed back from the men out there on how they feel sexually about their wives and the emotional needs you have.

Fortunately the men I have been with have had and have expressed emotional needs. So from a woman's POV, I can tell tiredandlost that I know men that do worry about being loved for who they are and want to know they have a partner who is there for them through difficult times. I also know men that need to know that their wives are there for them emotionally. My mom and dad went through difficult times financially as farmers and they always said what kept them going was that when one of them got down the other was there to keep them going. In other words my dad relied on my mom emotionally as often as mom relied on my dad emotionally - at least as farm as worrying about the farm and finances.

Again there are a lot of interesting points here and without much more background from TAL it's hard to say whether either of them have unrealistic expectations. IMO it's more likely that both of their positions are "realistic" and it's more that they are having issues with their communication and with being able to see the other person as a partner and someone on their side rather than as an adversary.

For example, IMO, the number of times her H wants sex a week is not so much an issue as the WAY he might DEMAND sex and not take TAL's feelings AT ALL into consideration. If he only wanted sex once a month but was cruel and demeaning and DEMANDED it from her, that would still be a relationship problem. And to be clear, I am NOT proposing any groveling begging behavior for sex either. I am talking about a man having a healthy (dare I say it)respect, LIKE and love for his wife in which she feels like a wife and not an object. And in return the wife should treat her H as someone she respects, likes and loves and not as an object.

Just my opinion and thoughts...

Yeah, I worry about myself sometimes. Like I'll be thinking "Are you sure you really want that in my mouth while I'm orgasming? You are quite brave."

Nor do I. I agree with you there. There are many other ways...all of which are important. But just about all of those other ways...THE MAN CAN GET FROM HIS MOTHER. He might as well stay and live with Mom if sex is going to be lacking. It wouldn't be bad...but it wouldn't be marriage. Marriage without sex isn't worth getting married for. THAT is the context in which I say "sex is the main thing he gets married for." Not that those other things aren't important as well...they're VERY important. But he doesn't have to get married for them. He can just stay home and live with Mom.



Yes, I absolutely can understand that feeling, and I agree with it. It would certainly be just as much of an insult for a woman if the rights to her vagina were the only thing he stuck around with her for...the same as if that were the case with her regarding his paycheck.

But going to the same analogy...if her husband is a loving husband, he's not going to divorce her for lack of sex any more than he would disown his own mother. There's more glue to both relationships than that. But if he isn't getting sex, he might just as well have stayed home and lived with mom. "The rest of the relationship" is his reason for staying with her, but the sex is his reason for marrying her. He can get love, companionship, friendship, and just about everything else by simply dating her without ever getting married....or by having a good male buddy...or by staying home and living with Mom. If sex isn't part of the deal, there's no reason to get married.



Yes, they do. But they also can usually get all those things from (I know this is getting repetitive ad naseum by now but it's still true)....Mom. Even in the Bible (Gen. 2:24) it says when a man leaves his mother and father he CLINGS to his wife and they become one flesh. Sex IS a principle aspect of marriage and it is THE aspect that makes marriage ... MARRIAGE. God didn't intend man to leave his mother to take unto himself another mother. He's supposed to be able to drink deeply of his milk, and have her enjoy doing the same with him (Solomon 5:1 or so, not-so-loosely paraphrased).



I agree with all that as well. Really, I do. I am just harping on the sex part predominantly and to the relative exclusion of the rest because that in my mind was the emphasis of the original post.

TAL Is there something with men only feeling closeness to their wives when they are ML? I should say sex, because my h is extremely kinky and this is just what if feels for me 90% of the time.

fearless IS feeling closeness with your wife ONLY with sex a normal feeling? Please note I asked about ONLY sex. Of course sex/ML is a great way to feel closeness but I, as a woman, don't think it should be the ONLY way anymore than any ONE thing should be the ONLY way.
Some times I feel close to BB in many ways and have expressed those feelings but there is little closeness I receive in return. Then there are the unresolved sexual feelings I have that build and go unresolved.

The unresolved turns into grumpiness and upping the determination to harder in the sex dept because if I left it to BB sex might only happen a couple times a year. If my W, BB doesn't do anything about the low sexual frequency, who is going to do something?

I think some women in TAL's position, put too much energy into the thought/feeling the H only wants her for sex. I can name several things when the R is good I like about BB. Sex is or was one of the things. When the R is not so good, I don't expect BB to meet my needs very often and many of the things I try to do for her are not good enough for her or she thinks I do them just to be selfish or just for sex.

I can't win those days. I say I do things because of reason "A" and BB tells me I did it for another reason. That situation becomes a no-win destructive activity.

I am wrong if I try to be nice. I am wrong if I protect myself, I am wrong if I work to many hours, so why play a no win game?

I feel that this is all he likes about me.
I don't know your H and I am different than your H, but I lived this off and on for many years. I quit playing that game. What would convince he likes you for sex and one other thing? Then name another thing he might like about you other than just for sex? If I could pry into his mind, I bet there are several things he likes or liked about you that don’t involve sex.

I heard a version of this “you don’t like me” attitude when I worked in juvenile corrections. Some boys would say I didn't like them because they were black, Hispanic, or Native American.

My reply was, "It didn't matter what ethnic group they identified with. I expected certain levels of conduct and decency. I said I don't like thieves and if they were proud they were thieves, well then maybe they had a clue why I was not warm hearted towards them some days.

He can be very cruel at times
This needs to change fast and he needs to improve his attitude and behaviors. No excuse for being cruel.

Instead of telling him what you don’t want, tell him how you feel when he is cruel and tell him what you want instead.

Be nice to me isn’t an answer. Saying talk instead of yell is an answer.

Lou

So the only difference in the relationship you have with your wife versus that with your mother is physical contact/sex???

HELLO. Good luck with that theory. Let me tell you there is no way in h*ck I was going to let my S18 continue living with me ad infinitum so maybe you ought to be a little grateful if you have a wife who is giving you some of what Mom gave you when you were a child. If you actually have a Mom who is sitting around in some little cottage wistfully looking out the window just hoping that you will appear around the corner to eat some of her pie then that might be a problem. When my son is your age, I hope to be doing stuff like hiking the Appalachian trail and f*cking in elder hostels. Of course, there will always be a chair at the turkey table round November for anyone who spent 9 mos. residing in my womb but....

Sorry but I would have to disagree with you and most of the men I know would too. Yes, you can get your meals cooked, washing done and have the company of your mother, but really, would it be the same?

If you can honestly say "yes" to that question, I think you have a lot more psychological and emotional problems than TAL

Lou,

I have to say your post just gives more credence to a theory I have that sex is not really the problem in most relationships it's just a SYMPTOM of other underlying problems. And those problems could be relationship/communication issues or would even be specific personal issues (typically being that one or both spouses are looking to the other spouse to MAKE them feel happy, complete, validated etc.).

I say this because if sex and only sex was the problem then it would most likely be a medical/psychological issue that could be addressed and would be addressed because everything else is so good with the relationship.

Again it's weird for me to read some many of these posts because I have never had so much angst, frustration and difficulty associated with sex in any of my relationships. I don't see myself as LD or HD and I am not an overly self-confident person as far as my looks or anything. The only thing I can look at is the fact that I have felt equal in my relationships and I have been with men that are not at all threatened by any of my strengths. Also sex is just something we do and enjoy and not some kind of battle ground for personal and relationship issues. I can also say that there are times I feel tired and not up to sex emotionally and thankfully the men I have been with have never been particularly bothered by it. (They just come back the next day and try again:) Usually to a positive result!) Somehow there seems to be a lot more than sex at hand in many of these interactions. Somehow it appears to me that many men take a single rejection and turn it into a much bigger issue than is initially meant by it. Then in turn the women see the angst, frustration, neediness, etc. from their H's as "proof" that all their H's want is sex and this cycle just allows each party to feel more entrenched with their beliefs and needs.

Just some of my thoughts. By no means do I think I have it figured out but I would love to think that I could help at least one person improve their relationship with some of these thoughts.