Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums Piecing Our Marriage Back Together Again NikkiB #16

Nikki,

Yes, this is normal. Yes, it has to do with PW in some way. Yes, you have quit GALing and become hyperfocused on H.

I would suggest --

-- not bringing up C of any sort again
-- not giving him any self-help books. If you must, leave 5LL in the bathroom, nothing more
-- inquire about how he feels like he is giving up on himself. LISTEN. Ask if there is any way you can get out of his way or otherwise help
-- give him permission to try in your M and not be a bad guy if he leaves anyway
-- if he suggests he needs space of any sort, agree, but tell him you will take the same space, you are not willing to be more into the R than he is
-- don't tell him what he needs or should need
-- clarify the scope of the honesty between the two of you (it obviously does not include contact with OW, for instance.)
-- go away for the weekend by yourself for yourself, your panic attacks tell you that without question you are not taking care of yourself

Alternatively, do absolutely nothing. GAL. Put him on double-secret probation for a month, then see where you are then.

Nikki,

I am so pressed for time i did not get a chance to read your sitch or all the posts. Just a little comment about the conversation with h. I gathered he left, then he came back. This IS a BIG DEAL for him to come back already. I think we think now he is back, we need to fix the R quickly so we can have a wonderful M together. I realize it is hard enough for h to come back (in the sense that it is VERY SCARY). He may be worried that he is not performing to YOUR standard. He may worry that if this does not work, hwo can he tell you AGAIN that he is leaving? After all, you are not just a stranger. He does somewhat cares about how you feel, no matter whether he chooses to leave or not.

I think, for my personl experience, it is best to just build positive experiences. My h reacts much nicer if I just don't ask about the limited continual contact with OW, and just do fun things with him. Or just tell him "that I was just thinking about you giving me a hug when we woke up and you did it. It feels so good. Thanks." If your h is doing the racecar thing, be all happy for him and be very interested, asking all kinds of silly or not so silly questions, etc. No matter what his real intention was, just pretend it IS for hte racecar. He may get influenced and decides that it IS for the racecar.

I think the conversation was good. It is difficult for him to say those thigns already. i would not mention MC anymore for a while. He heard you. He will go if he is ready. You can go and let him know about it.
gotta go. Good luck. Nto sure if I answer to your situation but here are some of my feelings anyway. hope it applies somewhat. Piecing is HARD. One thing I just realize is that I should just use him as a tool to make me happy (e.g. company for drinks, ask for a hug, etc.) rather than depending on him to make me happy. does this make sense?

Nikki,

IMOP I have to agree with OT here You need to GAL and act as if go back to the basics and give him the space he needs but set your boundries.

Funny this should be brought up as my H and I are piecing and I have been thinking myself, if I am starting to be to into the R and forgetting about what makes me happy. I need to think about this but i do know I need to keep (start again) doing things for me, to give my self the space i need to just breath. Funny I think I'll be a little mysterious myself tonight

I lurk on this forum but mainly im'e in the infidelity forum as I feel safe right now there not quite ready to move here yet to stay.

JAK

Hope your doing better today Nikki!

CK, Donna, ST, Oldtimer, Ourcrisis, jak - thank you!!

Lots of great points that you all make.

CK
You know I think you're right, we start having too many expectations. I think for me it was made worse (in a backwards way) by that really good 6 weeks or so that we had there before this. It reminded me of what we had at one time. Maybe it reminded H too and wasn't enough, or scared him that maybe it WAS enough, or... who knows.

Donna
I do have Xanax and hadn't taken it in months, but time to break it out again it looks like. I hate to do it but I'm not succeeding at getting myself through these attacks, and they're not doing me any good. And while the comforting from H is nice, they're not doing him any good either. I can these attacks are not ok, and I'm not succeeding at getting myself through them. During the day I can feel it coming and fight it off, but these keep happening at night. At least I only had one last night. They always start around 3-4 AM... maybe I set the alarm for 2:30 and take one then.

ST
Yeah I really didn't see it coming, either. And true - I'm glad he talked to me. He didn't mention IC, but did mention MC again - I think I'll go with the suggestion not to bring it up again though. At most I may make an appointment for myself (cause I could use it too) and let H know about it in case he wants to go. GAL... PMA... back to basics. You're right.

Oldtimer
Thanks. The cut back in GALing in a lot of ways was related to outside things that happened (dog's teeth/recovery, dad's heart attack/surgery/recovery). So I'm getting back to that now that things have calmed down - but you are right, I became WAY too focused on H.

I appreciate all the suggestions. I guess I've gotten better at this stuff on some level because most of what you said sounded "right" to me - as opposed to early on when every suggestion here sounds like "What? That can't be right!" If that makes sense. With one exception.. somehow the doing nothing feels like more of the same.. now that he opened up to me, not talking about it, ignoring his emotions feels like falling back into a very bad pattern. So I think I'll go with your first list of suggestions, for now.

I do have a couple of questions on your suggestions:



I am really glad to hear you say it's OK to ask more about this, because I wanted to but felt unsure if it was ok. I remembered more of our phone convo after and I did ask him to tell me if there's "anything I can do, or not do, to help."



I do see that this is important, but I'm struggling with the "how" of it. How do I say this without sounding like I am pushing him out? And yeah.. he won't be a bad guy, but it WILL hurt me badly. Should I be honest about that or just not talk about it?

Also how do I say it that "try" doesn't just mean "show up"?? It's ok for now but long term, I'm not OK with being the "easier" solution and that's all. I deserve better (and so does he). So maybe I answered my own question and I don't need to say that second part now.. but could still use help with the first part.

Ourcrisis
Yes - he left and came back. And I think you're right - he keeps reassuring me he's not going anywhere while at the same time saying he gave up on himself. So yeah, I think guilt or "how can I leave AGAIN" is part of it. I like your ideas as well, back way off in terms of my focus on him, but keep building the positives too.

jak
Back to basics... thanks. I don't even know if space is what he needs, but I see now that I need to focus less on him and our M for now.

And lots of you had a couple of the same suggestions so I replied here...

On the giving up on himself - I'm glad so many of you felt it was OK to ask him more about this. I wanted to but I always feel I'm on the border of overdoing the questions. I will ask about this when the time seems right.

About the PW/OW, yes, I do think there's influence there. I don't know if it's initiated on H's side or hers, so it's kind of a "chicken and egg" thing (did he start feeling this way and then contact resumed? or did they resume contact and she's influencing him again?). But looking at the timeline... the distance I began feeling started almost simultaneously with them re-starting the frequent contact. Clearly I have no control over this, but just wanted to mention it since you guys brought it up.

About the MC, self help books, etc. I think I may leave 5LL out on the coffee table, but that's about it. I bought the audio version to listen to in the car. H is mildly dyslexic and really hates to read (gives him a horrible headache), so at least it's in a format he might like if he decides to listen to it. I will most likely go to the MC myself and let him know I'm going (not ask him to go, just let him know and he's welcome if he decides to go).

Thanks again all. Feeling a bit calmer today and like I'm starting to develop a plan.

I may try to get away somewhere for part of the weekend. With Sunday being Father's day I can't really go away all weekend, but agree I need some "me" time.

--H cannot feel good around you when he is lying about PW. He will project and make it a problem with you, but the real problem is his own guilt.

-- "H, I want you to know that I don't want to be a default wife anymore than you want to give up on yourself. I am open to trying this R and seeing how it works for both of us. I think I get that you open to the same. If so, then we both need to be very clear on the fact that we are working on the M together, but if it doesn't work out and one of us leaves, that is really OK. I want an M where we are both freely choosing to be in it together, and that can only be the case if we both feel free to make other choices. We just need to be honest about what is going on."

-- Too bad if you get hurt if H leaves again. It is your choice to take the emotional risk of trying to reconcile. You accept the emotional consequences. Of course he knows you will be hurt if he leaves again, duh. But you really need to take ownership of the risk and consequences. By no means hold it over his head. Do the opposite. Take ownership and tell him you are a big girl and can handle the consequences of any emotional risks you choose to take. If you cannot say that and mean it, then I suggest you separate until you can.

Thanks OT.

What do you suggest on the lying about PW? I think that he's doing it because of the conversation we had - he kept talking about her and I was really upset about it, he could tell and then asked if I wanted him to be honest. My reply was "Yes, but what I really want is for you not to have anything you're uncomfortable being honest about" (or something along those lines). That's when he started hiding it again. I think you're right about the guilt etc. but do I do anything about this? Or just kind of accept that it's the case and let it go?

Thank you SO much for the wording suggestion. I like it.

I know not to hold it over his head. I guess that's where I was confused. It would be dishonest to say it would be no big deal to me and I kind of thought that's what you meant. I understand what you meant now. I can say it and be maybe 90% sure I mean it... a small part of me thinks I'm just lying to myself, but I kinda feel like that's something I'd never be 100% clear on.

With respect to PW, again, you need to figure out YOUR boundary and enforce it.

It does not matter why H is in contact with PW. It matters that he is and that he is lying to you about it.

What do you choose to do? Pick one of the following or make up your own.

1) accept the contact and the lying
2) accept the contact but require honesty
3) accept contact only if you are present in person or by phone
4) don't accept the contact
5) put your head in the sand and ignore it

Oldtimer... thanks. Since I have 0 control over 2 and 3 as H has repeatedly demonstrated, and I'm not willing to give an ultimatem right now (#2 - #4), I guess it's between 1 and 5. I don't particularly like THOSE choices either so will have to think about it more.

I want to believe if I can handle #1 for awhile and get back to basics, and our M starts to move in a more positive direction, then the contact will decrease. But can our M even move in that direction while the contact is still going on??

Just thinking aloud....