Divorcebusting.com Forums Open Forums Piecing Our Marriage Back Together Again NikkiB #16

Nikki, it really is funny because when I read the book I found examples that shouted "this is you!" I also know that whenever W wanted to "talk about the R" I would cringe. I knew I wasn't going to be hearing "I just wanted to tell you how happy you've been making me lately", it would all be about how I wasn't measuring up. So R talk was always difficult even when I tried to be open and willing to work on change. She once told me that I didn't listen to her in the way she needed. I agreed to try and change the way I listened but asked that she help me out by pointing out when I was falling into the old pattern (you know the one, trying to fix it versus listening). She told me "If I have to teach you then you can't do it!" Wow, talk about a PMA boost. Anyway, I hope you'll check out the book, I found it helpful in understanding the female mind as well as the male.

Nikki, I think you meant whatisis that recommended the book.

very glad you mentioned it whatisis. I may have to check out that book myself. Have you read For Women Only? Shaunti Feldham? If I remember right, it has the same kind of insights. Although after reading your last post, I guess you probably wouldn't read it since your a male! So how did you know about the other one? Or does it talk about both male and female views?

Shaunti Feldham also wrote "For Men Only". I've been meaning to get it, just to read and see how closely I relate. I'm sure it's extremely well written, because the other one was so insightful.

Whatisis, what would you recommend for us women to do instead of going to our man and saying, I need to talk about the R blah blah.... ?

ST, cliffy, whatisis - thanks for checking in

ST - whoops, you're right, thanks for mentioning that. Whatisis - thanks for the book recommendation!

Cliffy - yeah, definitely trouble letting go, and it seems trouble not being sucked right back in too. Ugh. All I keep thinking is "NOT AGAIN."

Before I get into all the H stuff - my dad is doing GREAT!! I can't believe how quickly he's up and around, but I'm thrilled.

So things have continued to get stranger with H...

Friday night I called H to let him know I was on my way to my sis's dance class and he was really caught off guard it seemed like. He said "Oh! I was just leaving happy hour to come home." I said sorry I hadn't told him sooner, he usually stays at happy hour longer so I thought we'd be home around the same time. But he was upbeat, said "no biggie" and told me to have a good time and he'd see me later. Then he asked me to call him after the class so he could join us for dinner.

After class.. called a couple of times, no answer. H called back about 2 hours later and in an almost angry tone told me he'd gone over to his mom's house to show her his race video. We talked a bit about that but he was really short with me - then said he was heading home and was I on the way there. I said yes... he said "see you soon"... got home... and no H. He finally showed up about 90 minutes later fairly drunk (NOT pleased he was driving like that!), dressed up like he was going out, and acting very pissy.

I tried to ignore the negativity and said "Wow you look nice" (positive, upbeat tone). He said "Yeah I thought I might be able to find something to do but no luck. I went to my mom's, it was better than sleeping on the couch." Then in a really snotty tone "But you have to get dressed up, you never know where you might end up." Then he ran through all the people he had called and not called to find something to do (PW was on the "not called" list). I didn't prompt any of this, he just did it.

All night he kept saying these weird, "mysterious" type things alternating with really down, depressed things. It all reminded me VERY much of my H just before and just after the bomb. It was pretty bad. Just as an example he told me about something he had fixed at work and I said "You're so good!" (common phrase for us to say to each other in the good times). He said "Stop saying that. No I'm not. I'm not good at all." I finally decided to just not talk to him at all since he was responding to everything I said so negatively. Focused on the show we were watching instead - then H started on a stream of negative or angry comments related to the show. sheesh!!

I finally said "H I'm worried, you haven't sounded this down in a really long time." He looked at me like he had no idea what I was talking about and said almost laughing "Oh really?" I said "Yeah, you seemed like you were pretty happy the last couple of months but the last couple of weeks and especially tonight you seem really down. Did something happen?" He said "Yes" but that he didn't want to tell me any more because it would hurt me. I told him I'd be glad to listen if he wanted to tell me but he said he didn't. Then he said he needed to get back to working on his cars more because it helps him keep his mind straight. During the bomb talk he told me he used the cars to 'escape' from me... then recently talked about how much he loves the excitement of racing... now what? We're back to the cars are only an escape???

(Oldtimer... I can already hear you saying not to "manage" H but I am so confused on that whole thing. One of H's complaints was that I didn't notice or pay attention to his emotional needs so how do I balance that?? Am I getting any better??)

I wish he would tell me what happened so I can stop imagining the worst. But I didn't push him on it. I know that what matters in terms of our M isn't what happened but how it's affecting us, so I'm trying to focus on that instead.

Friday night had a bunch of nightmares and Saturday morning I woke up to a really bad anxiety attack. Yuck. I finally got calmed down and got my hands to "unlock" (I hyperventilate and my hands and whole upper body clench up, it's really scary). During and after the attack H held me. I was just getting back under control when H said "I'm sorry I'm stressing you out." I lost it... ANOTHER anxiety attack... turned into a sobbing mess.

When I could finally talk again I said "H I'm scared." I was going to say more but couldn't talk. H still holding me said "I'm not going anywhere, if that's what you're scared of." I said "You're not?" H said "No, I'm not leaving." (but his tone sounded resigned). I said (attempted jokingly although I don't think I succeeded) "Now I'm scared you're just telling me that to calm me down." He replied (much softer tone) "No, I mean it, I'm not going anywhere."

The rest of the day H seemed back to his old self - happy, upbeat, friendly. It scares the heck out of me that he can either a. switch moods/personalities SO quickly or b. hide his unhappiness so well.

We did our own things separately most of the day, then I went and hung out with him for awhile while he worked on his car. Felt so good and so normal. Later he invited me along to run errands with him, which I did - and thanked him for the invitation, said I had fun running errands together. Last night we went out to dinner and then out to play pool for awhile. I'm terrible at it but it was still fun.

I am now officially even MORE confused than I was when the bomb dropped, I think.

Hmmm, if I had to tell a backstory it would be this:

1) You rather passive aggressively didn't tell H about your plans until the last minute.

2) This pissed H off. He had been being a good boy, but acted out in some way to retaliate.

3) H's guilt from his own acting out put him in a tailspin, and he became angry at the world rather than himself.

4) Rather than reporting about herself, Nikki interrogates H, putting more pressure on him.

5) Finally in the morning, Nikki reports about herself, with much better results.

As to whatever H did, it sounds like you are willing to let it go. It is something he feels crappy about, and knows is "bad", thus him being pissed at you for calling him "good." If I were in your shoes, I would ask about it for my own sake: "H, you don't automatically get to stay with me. If you are hiding things from me because you believe they would hurt me, I deserve to know what they are. I need to be able to make informed decisions about my life. It isn't fair for you to withhold information relevant to my decisions."

Whatever he did is either a dealbreaker or not. In my book, it is better to know which one. Then again, this early into the reconcilliation, you are unlikely to get an honest answer. So, who knows.

Or - you might point out to H -
"H, you're not really trying to protect me from hurt, you're really trying to protect YOURSELF from having to see my hurt. I'm a big girl and I deserve the truth - I can handle it."

Ellie

Sorry you've been put in such a predicament lately.

I also wonder if H did something recently, that is causing strain on him and putting it on you. Or maybe it had something to do with your dad. I don't see why you telling him about the dance class was bad. If he normally stays out longer, then are you really to tell him your every move and at an early enough time?

I'm thinking there is more here. Maybe it is a little setback for him, just with his feelings on his own mortality. I mean, during the main part of your sitch, H seemed very depressed.. so I always wondered about it being MLC or just plain depression... and I think probably for most people, they may still have times where those thoughts come back and they can end up taking it out on the ones they love.

Maybe it is guilt? I don't know. What you should continue doing is focusing on you and not him, and not letting his craziness turn you crazy. There's going to be lots of times where H's actions make you upset or whatever, and we are going to do it to them as well, but we have to remember not to let their actions control our happiness.

I'm sorry you had a anxiety attack. Now I think we know why they were happening. Your body is just taking over for the stress it is reacting to in regards to your struggles with H. Really try to keep that confidence up and take care of yourself.

Oldtimer, Ellie, ST, thanks!!

OT
In my defense on #1... I actually didn't MAKE the plans til the last minute. I decided at around 4:30, got ready and left at 5 and called as soon as I left. But I do see your point, and I should probably have called to run it by him BEFORE deciding so we could clarify timelines and such.

Thanks for helping me see the "story" more clearly. I actually think #2 and #3 have been going on for awhile. It was more obvious and dramatic on Friday, but something has been "off" for a couple of weeks. At first I was blaming myself thinking it coincided with my blowing up about the calls to PW, but in hindsight I think whatever "it" was happened a few days or maybe a week before that and likely didn't even involve me. And also in hindsight I think I "felt" the distance but didn't recognize that's what I was feeling, reacted by snooping and then flipping out on H about the "symptom" (the calls) rather than talking to him about the actual issue, the distance I was feeling.

You're right that I'm most likely willing to let whatever it was go. I might get an honest answer, but if it follows his pattern lately I'd get a semi-honest answer followed by a lot of justifications why it's not wrong. Given those two things I think it may not do me much good to ask about it, but I will have to think about it more. I like the way you phrased it.

Ellie
That's a good point. I am a little hesitant on the telling him what he's feeling (that he's afraid of seeing my hurt) - but I think I can say something like that, if I do bring it up. Or point out that it's hurting me either way, but I deserve to know since it is affecting my life and may affect my decisions.

ST
I agree that it's some kind of stress he's taking out on me (or at least, wanting distance from me again as a result of it). Based on the way he talked about it I think it's something very specific that happened as opposed to a general anxiety, depression, stress, etc. that's been building. I would think it was related to my dad's health issue but I think it was longer ago.

Yeah, I think those anxiety attacks are my body's way of forcing the stress to the surface. Guess it's not really possible to bury it, just different ways to let it out!

Thank you for the reminder to focus on me, especially that confidence piece. That's a big one.

A small part of me is considering going to that party on Friday (the one PW might show up at). What a huge boost that would be if I could get the strength up to be cool, confident, fun, sexy, outgoing and really shine even in that situation (it's the "if" that scares me!). I also realize that it goes against my boundary of no social contact with PW.. but since that contact is happening anyway... maybe it's another angle to approach it from. Any thoughts? Even if you just want to say "You're crazy!" go for it..

Feeling a lot better today, thank goodness.

My gut says you AND H don't go to social events where OW will be. If H insists on going, then you go too, but preferably neither of you go. Stay out of the mud with the pigs.

Ellie

Why don't you happily suggest to H that you both go, and if PW shows up you can bail and do XYZ instead. Make the XYZ something fun and sexy...

"H, we can't control whether PW goes to the party or not, all we can do is control our actions. So, lets plan to go to the party and have a good time. If she shows up, we can bail, I promise to show you a good time anyway..."

Ellie - H said he wouldn't go if I don't, so that was good. He was kind of "pouty" about it though. Out of the mud's a good place to be.

Oldtimer - I love that idea on so many levels!! Especially taking control out of PW's hands. I was ok with not going but it was kind of irritating me that she was impacting our actions. Hmmm now gotta think of a fun backup plan.